2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
ferrari stole some points off rbr, so mclaren are really lucky! Mclaren expects to be stronger at hungary as button said that their package is strong on either high or low downforce but not in between. But if they do end up as still the 3rd fastest team, then i hope ferrari would score another 1-2, but this time with massa winning (and dnf's for rbr )
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Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
Yep that's right. Ferrari thinks about winning the drivers championship, and Alonso has a bigger chance than Massa, so in a way, letting Alonso winning is logical, even if I thought the contrary just after the race. But they did something not only illegal, but also unsportive. BUT in the result, it is not worse than in Australia 09 when McLaren and Hamilton lied to the stewards, resulting to a temporary DQ of Trulli who was 3rd. This was worse because it involved and other team in the process.TwistedArmco wrote: Strongly put, but a valid argument. Also, you have to ask yourself whether the team orders changed anything except on an intra-Ferrari level. You could argue that, because there was no chance of anyone but Ferrari winning that the drivers are at much lesser fault than the team itself. Alonso didn't himself cheat, nor did Massa. therefore, I think, ethically, a rescinding of Ferrari's constructors' championship points for anywhere up to the rest of the season would be fair. After all, they did do something that was illegal, but it waas sensible in context.
About Alonso now, imo he is one of the best driver on the field, if not the best, but it's another event that tarnish his reputation, since Hungary 07. He didn't need that, he already proves that he can win on track without the team using dirty tricks .
But one thing for sure, this discussion is way way better than the race itself
Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
Pit-stop summary
Stints
Green - supersoft, black - hard tyre
Stints
Green - supersoft, black - hard tyre
Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
if anyone wants to know why was Sutil and Liuzzi so many times in box - cuz the mechanics did a stupid and embarrasing mistake, after Sutil s pit stop they put him 3 hard and 1 soft tyre on his car, and Liuzzi the opposite - now that is really stupid
Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
quite funny. It was really unfortunate for them. I guess the management would have come down hard on that poor mechanicalex1369 wrote:if anyone wants to know why was Sutil and Liuzzi so many times in box - cuz the mechanics did a stupid and embarrasing mistake, after Sutil s pit stop they put him 3 hard and 1 soft tyre on his car, and Liuzzi the opposite - now that is really stupid
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Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
Force India mechanics probably decided to partially favor Sutil over Liuzzi ..alex1369 wrote:if anyone wants to know why was Sutil and Liuzzi so many times in box - cuz the mechanics did a stupid and embarrasing mistake, after Sutil s pit stop they put him 3 hard and 1 soft tyre on his car, and Liuzzi the opposite - now that is really stupid
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Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
yeah, with saw that in Monaco where downforce is extreme.megasyxx wrote:ferrari stole some points off rbr, so mclaren are really lucky! Mclaren expects to be stronger at hungary as button said that their package is strong on either high or low downforce but not in between. But if they do end up as still the 3rd fastest team, then i hope ferrari would score another 1-2, but this time with massa winning (and dnf's for rbr )
Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
Brasilian fans must love Ferrari by now...
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Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
One thing funny, did you see how the t-cam of Button moved once during an onboard shot? I was ill after seeing that shot
Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
Yamamoto's race was ruined by two errors:
- Forgetting to use the pit lane speed limiter at the start, which meant he barely got away
- Set off the fire extinguisher in the engine compartment while trying to adjust the brake bias.
No embroidery here, this is totally true. And the guy's an F1 driver...
- Forgetting to use the pit lane speed limiter at the start, which meant he barely got away
- Set off the fire extinguisher in the engine compartment while trying to adjust the brake bias.
No embroidery here, this is totally true. And the guy's an F1 driver...
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Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
I really don't get this bashing towards Ferrari. What they did considering their sub-par points' position, any other team would have done it.
Everyone has team orders. For years since 2002, the last 4 races are so obvious with team orders. Kimi did for Massa in 2008. Kova for Ham in 2008. Massa for Kimi in 2007. Fisi for Alonso in 2006. It's endless. It never was an issue when Berger did it for Senna?
It's part of the sport, and it's a stupid rule that needs to go.
With that aside, Rob wasn't bright with his genius message. How about (Massa you need to slow down as you might have brake problems.)
And Massa was a child about it as well. His fault for being so down in the points against Alonso.
And no, why should Ferrari get point deductions? Then the FIA should review all the previous seasons and adjust the points for them as well. Team orders exist in every race in every team. Button's comment is way too hypocritical.
Everyone has team orders. For years since 2002, the last 4 races are so obvious with team orders. Kimi did for Massa in 2008. Kova for Ham in 2008. Massa for Kimi in 2007. Fisi for Alonso in 2006. It's endless. It never was an issue when Berger did it for Senna?
It's part of the sport, and it's a stupid rule that needs to go.
With that aside, Rob wasn't bright with his genius message. How about (Massa you need to slow down as you might have brake problems.)
And Massa was a child about it as well. His fault for being so down in the points against Alonso.
And no, why should Ferrari get point deductions? Then the FIA should review all the previous seasons and adjust the points for them as well. Team orders exist in every race in every team. Button's comment is way too hypocritical.
Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
Mercedes should have started Schumacher with Hard tyre, since option was available due to p11. Schumacher with lighter fuel load on soft + Rosberg soft tyre data in hand .. ohh another mess up!!!
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Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
Oh! Outraged sport lovers,
what happened in Hockenheim 2008?
There weren't team orders?
All the overtakings were OK?
What happened with Kovalainen?
Thanks in advance for your answers.
what happened in Hockenheim 2008?
There weren't team orders?
All the overtakings were OK?
What happened with Kovalainen?
Thanks in advance for your answers.
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Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
pacocopan wrote:Oh! Outraged sport lovers,
what happened in Hockenheim 2008?
There weren't team orders?
All the overtakings were OK?
What happened with Kovalainen?
Thanks in advance for your answers.
kovalainen? LOL what a joke if there were team orders kovi would of been right behind hamilton instead of finishing atleast 4 places behind him in almost evry GP
no need to thank me i was born with common sense.
if ferarri (stefano) did there own dirty work and didnt involve rob smedley they would have done things a little better im sure but they deserve the reaction they got. alonso would have got him sooner or later i am sure of that but alonso threw his toys and ferarri arent man enought to handle him or massa for that matter so they got rob to do it.
shame shame
i not denying that team orders happen and it definatly did
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Re: 2010 Großer Preis Santander von Deutschland
And maybe didn't it occur that Alonso threw his toys simply because the orders were already established way before the race?dazmoffman wrote:pacocopan wrote: if ferarri (stefano) did there own dirty work and didnt involve rob smedley they would have done things a little better im sure but they deserve the reaction they got. alonso would have got him sooner or later i am sure of that but alonso threw his toys and ferarri arent man enought to handle him or massa for that matter so they got rob to do it.
shame shame
i not denying that team orders happen and it definatly did
Also what does Stefano have to do with communicating with Massa or not? Massa would have still acted like he did. And Rob was continiously telling Massa to push forward whilst Alonso was trying to over take him. So yeah, Rob had to give him the order... At the end, the fault is of Rob and Massa. Not Alonso and Stefano... Eventhough I don't rate Stefano, here I'll side with him.