Formula 1 Grand Prix Du Canada 2013

[François]

Yup, I'm pretty certain Pirelli can just swap tyres around and nobody, be it the FIA, engineers or drivers will be able to tell the difference! Seriously, what crack are you conspiracy theorists on?

Everybody's improving their tyre management all the time. Canada is a very different track to all the others so far, with virtually no high speed corners: just accelerating, braking and chicanes and hairpins. It's also a much shorter lap than many circuits. This all can account for the difference in durability to what you were apparently expecting.

[donald29]

Interesting, Martin Brundle says he thinks Vettel would just beat Alonso in an equal car.

http://www1.skysports.com/formula-1/new ... hat-lasted

[phil1993]

What staggers me is that Vettel is still only 25. He has the potential to be better than Alonso. And he already has 3, possibly 4 titles. It's frightening, I don't think we'll see it happen again. Equally, Vettel's 2013 title* could be his last. After all, who would have said at the end of 2006 that seven years later Alonso would be without a third title...

*probably.

[Eric_Cartman]

What staggers me is that Vettel is still only 25. He has the potential to be better than Alonso. And he already has 3, possibly 4 titles. It's frightening, I don't think we'll see it happen again. Equally, Vettel's 2013 title* could be his last. After all, who would have said at the end of 2006 that seven years later Alonso would be without a third title...

*probably.

After 2006 I thought Alonso could be able to beat Schumacher's record of seven titles. Now you have to say that Vettel is on a good way to beat that. But nobody knows what's gonna happen. May be Red Bull doesn't have a car capable of winning the championship in the next years, especially with the new rules in 2014.

[Ether]

Yeah, Vettel is good, he was lucky to be a champion in 2010, but 2011 was both he did a pretty good job, 2012 did a solid job, 2013 so far did a marvelous job. He is improving, yes he is. He has a potential to be a better driver than Alonso and Hamilton, yes. But, if he stays in RB and RB stays as a champion car with nobody able to beat or fight around, I could see a limitation of what Vettel could learn or achieve.
Some lessons which Vettel need to learn are:
1. Learning to lose fair and square
2. Do the best he could without winning or being in a team with no special intention of fighting championship (this.. I think Hamilton now learning it.. and Alonso already had lots of exp in this)
3. Being calm and cool. Mental stability. This also, Alonso had it for quite some time. Hamilton, had it in 2012, and 2013, he is becoming more and more strong in terms of mental.
4. Using the brain over ambition. Ambition is good, yes. But sometimes it's unnecessary. Many times we see, Vettel want a total domination, fastest lap yes! he wants it badly! Even I think it's really is unnecessary. I really hope he will do something wrong when he tries doing it, and got retired because of his silliness. Then he will learn something.
5. Respecting other drivers. This is of course cannot be learn for a rookie that instantly becoming world champion, and continuously world champion! Telling other driver as cucumber, stupid, etc is very disrespectful. I think Alonso is quite silent on when he is actually very furious, but he need to stop using bad words on other drivers. I believe Alonso had some situation with Perez back then in Monaco, but he just accept it as a part of fighting with "stupid" drivers. Hamilton, was furious too with Pastor in Valencia, he really mad to him, and then he realize himself that he himself who should change when fighting with certain drivers.. Back to his own, not pointing fingers on other drivers and telling bad words.

[iceman1]

I still remember Alonso saying he'll return once he wins his 3rd championship. Everyone was surprised back then, they thought he'll return before 2010

Anyway, Alonso didn't want to overtake Hamilton at the detection zone

[Joey Zyla]

Yeah, Vettel is good, he was lucky to be a champion in 2010, but 2011 was both he did a pretty good job, 2012 did a solid job, 2013 so far did a marvelous job. He is improving, yes he is. He has a potential to be a better driver than Alonso and Hamilton, yes. But, if he stays in RB and RB stays as a champion car with nobody able to beat or fight around, I could see a limitation of what Vettel could learn or achieve.
Some lessons which Vettel need to learn are:
1. Learning to lose fair and square
2. Do the best he could without winning or being in a team with no special intention of fighting championship (this.. I think Hamilton now learning it.. and Alonso already had lots of exp in this)
3. Being calm and cool. Mental stability. This also, Alonso had it for quite some time. Hamilton, had it in 2012, and 2013, he is becoming more and more strong in terms of mental.
4. Using the brain over ambition. Ambition is good, yes. But sometimes it's unnecessary. Many times we see, Vettel want a total domination, fastest lap yes! he wants it badly! Even I think it's really is unnecessary. I really hope he will do something wrong when he tries doing it, and got retired because of his silliness. Then he will learn something.
5. Respecting other drivers. This is of course cannot be learn for a rookie that instantly becoming world champion, and continuously world champion! Telling other driver as cucumber, stupid, etc is very disrespectful. I think Alonso is quite silent on when he is actually very furious, but he need to stop using bad words on other drivers. I believe Alonso had some situation with Perez back then in Monaco, but he just accept it as a part of fighting with "stupid" drivers. Hamilton, was furious too with Pastor in Valencia, he really mad to him, and then he realize himself that he himself who should change when fighting with certain drivers.. Back to his own, not pointing fingers on other drivers and telling bad words.

Your strong dislike for Vettel is quite obvious in that post. Point 1 is unfair because you can't assume that just because someone wins a lot means they are a sore loser. Point 2 is just silly when you consider how well Vettel did at Toro Rosso, including his victory in the 2008 Italian Grand Prix. I also disagree with your third point as Vettel has very rarely made mistakes this season. You sound a bit jealous, to be honest.

[F1EA]

Vettel is definitely good. He's also improving....

He is not better than Alonso, he probably never will, but the truth is.. who cares?

Its not a matter of who is better.... there's the car, the team, the era. Vettel's numbers are great, Alonso's ability is great, Hamilton's speed is great. Given some conditions, the three of them can get the numbers Vettel is getting.

So in the end, people will always give then their recognition. Perhaps Alonso will be Senna'ed despite Vettel getting the numbers... all he needs is to win over the Brits ;)

[Joey Zyla]

I think if Vettel, Alonso, Hamilton, and Raikkonen were driving equal cars, Alonso might just get the edge over Vettel, with Hamilton just ahead of Raikkonen for third.

[mikhailv]

Yeah, Vettel is good, he was lucky to be a champion in 2010, but 2011 was both he did a pretty good job, 2012 did a solid job, 2013 so far did a marvelous job. He is improving, yes he is. He has a potential to be a better driver than Alonso and Hamilton, yes. But, if he stays in RB and RB stays as a champion car with nobody able to beat or fight around, I could see a limitation of what Vettel could learn or achieve.
Some lessons which Vettel need to learn are:
1. Learning to lose fair and square
2. Do the best he could without winning or being in a team with no special intention of fighting championship (this.. I think Hamilton now learning it.. and Alonso already had lots of exp in this)
3. Being calm and cool. Mental stability. This also, Alonso had it for quite some time. Hamilton, had it in 2012, and 2013, he is becoming more and more strong in terms of mental.
4. Using the brain over ambition. Ambition is good, yes. But sometimes it's unnecessary. Many times we see, Vettel want a total domination, fastest lap yes! he wants it badly! Even I think it's really is unnecessary. I really hope he will do something wrong when he tries doing it, and got retired because of his silliness. Then he will learn something.
5. Respecting other drivers. This is of course cannot be learn for a rookie that instantly becoming world champion, and continuously world champion! Telling other driver as cucumber, stupid, etc is very disrespectful. I think Alonso is quite silent on when he is actually very furious, but he need to stop using bad words on other drivers. I believe Alonso had some situation with Perez back then in Monaco, but he just accept it as a part of fighting with "stupid" drivers. Hamilton, was furious too with Pastor in Valencia, he really mad to him, and then he realize himself that he himself who should change when fighting with certain drivers.. Back to his own, not pointing fingers on other drivers and telling bad words.

Your strong dislike for Vettel is quite obvious in that post. Point 1 is unfair because you can't assume that just because someone wins a lot means they are a sore loser. Point 2 is just silly when you consider how well Vettel did at Toro Rosso, including his victory in the 2008 Italian Grand Prix. I also disagree with your third point as Vettel has very rarely made mistakes this season. You sound a bit jealous, to be honest.

Number 1 isn't really important. All it will do is give him value and appreciation for winning. Number 2 I believe your refering to an MP4-24 or MP4-19 or R29 year that Ham/Rai/Alo has had. Number 3, right now Vettel has been the most consistent driver. Until he is challenged this year for a win, he wont need to have any of that. Number 4 will come with time. Number 5 he already does as well to be honest.

Though I will say, Toro Rosso thing is overblown. We all know how great the STR cars were in 2007 and 2008 in the wet. The fact the car had the pace in the race as well as a 1-2 in qualifying demonstrates that it was a bloody good car. Its not like he dragged a Minardi to pole and won by the skin of his teeth. It was a lights to flag victory with no challenge. Not diminishing the win, but it is over exaggerated quite alot because on paper you think 'wow an STR won'. After taking a 1-2 and setting what, one of the top 5 fastest laps in the race?

[François]

RE: Monza 2008, it was a 1-4 and not a 1-2. You also have to consider that many of the big guns missed out on Q3 mostly due to circumstances (late increase in rain leaving them unable to improve): Kubica, Räikkönen and Hamilton. The gap between Vettel and Bourdais was nine tenths!

What does it tell us? 1/ that the wet conditions flattered the STR car, but didn't necessarily make it the class of the field and 2/ that Vettel's lap must've been quite special, beating his teammate by such a large margin.

[mikhailv]

Yeah Heikki was second and Webber 3rd. I get mixed up thinking he was alongside vettel. As you said, he out qualified Bourdais by 9 tenths, but he was 6 tenths faster than webber but a tenth faster than Heikki. It was all track position. Was Vettel really 2.2 seconds faster than Glock and Alonso? 1.3 seconds faster than Massa? No.

Its exaggerated massively.

[François]

I don't know, with the exception of Alonso, it seems pretty consistent with the race pace. Heikki wasn't too shabby and hung onto second but Webber, Rosberg, Glock and Trulli faded massively and Massa was unable to improve his position. Of course leading the field was an advantage but it didn't stop several people from making great comebacks through the field.

[tderias]

Now this is interesting:


It looks like Hamilton backs off the gas to lure Alonso into an overtake, just so that he can get DRS and mug him down the straight. Alonso doesn't fall for it and lifts off himself.

Clever driving from both drivers. Don't hate the player, hate the game... But seriously what has F1 come to?

[mikhailv]

Thats just smart driving from both drivers.