Petronas Malaysia Grand Prix 2013

[François]

Haha, excellent.

[mikhailv]

Its certainly the most controversial thing I've seen since 2010, even more than 'Fernando is faster than you'...

We'll see how it plays out. Honestly coming to think about, I can't make up my mind if its a positive or negative to Vettel's CV.

It can show complete ruthlessness and desire for nothing less than P1, then again it is at the expense of other people, and can be considered cheating since Webber was a sitting duck.

Only time will tell...

Well to a future Formula 1 team he may want to move to he has shown;

A) He isn't a team player
B) He will disobey the team after multiple requests
C) He is willing to risk his car against a teammate
D) He is willing to go against agreements made with the team and teammate
E) Happily use team orders if they are beneficial but refuse them if they are detrimental.
F) When Helmut Dicko cant even defend you, you know you crossed a line.

If your Ferrari and you've got Alonso. If your mercedes and you've got Hamilton. Would you take Vettel on, knowing that he is against drivers of better calibre, but knowing he will A) Disobey team orders B) put his and his teammates car at risk and C) Go against any pre-agreement/gentleman's word?

Hamilton and Alonso would begrudgingly do what Nico Rosberg did.

Just Vettel showing the ruthlessness of a true great.

No, there's ruthlessness like Overtaking your teammate into the pitlane. Then there's sticking two fingers up at your employers, ignoring everything they request, publicly saying 'I don't know what it meant, im so sorry' only for the team boss to come out and say 'bulls**' to everything Vettel said. Hell he's quoted by german media saying he wasn't sorry at all. After his public 'apology'.

Theres ruthless overtaking on rivals. Then there is imbecilic disobedience and isolating yourself to the point where your own employers and Marko cant even defend him.

Schumacher wouldn't have disobeyed Ferrari. He played supporting role to Irvine did he not?

Payback's a b!tch ain't it?

Webber disobeys teamorders in Britain 2011: everyone supports Webber for disobeying teamorders
Webber disobeys teamorders in Abu Dhabi 2012: everyone slants Red Bull for giving teamorders
Webber disobeys teamorders in Brazil 2012: everyone slants Vettel for not starting faster
Vettel disobeys teamorders in Malaysia 2013: OMG, teamorders should always be followed!!

Webber needs to man up and dry his eyes. He ain't no saint when it comes to obeying team orders.

Team orders is team orders. The thing with Redbull isn't about giving team orders. It's about how they continually harp on about being equal and not using team orders, then the above happens. If they just come out and say 'Webber is number 2, Vettel is number 1' then that's it. Webber was a d**k in Brazil. Abu Dhabi was hilarious because it was off the back of 'we don't use team orders' malarkey. Most of the time, Webber should perform better over the season and he wouldn't be in those positions.

But two wrongs don't make a right. I hope Horner gives his same speech to Vettel as he did with Webber;

race Horner said: “It’s a team result. Circumstances earlier in the race… Sebastian had a KERS issue that we were dealing with and the last thing you want to do is see the team give away a whole load of points.

“From a team point of view we decided that it was best to hold the positions in the final two laps.

“Obviously Mark disagreed with that. The thing is, I can understand he’s maybe a little bit frustrated, but from a team point of view we can’t afford to give away a whole load of points.

Asked if this meant Webber could no longer fight for the championship Horner said: “No, not at all.

“But you get to that stage in the race we’d managed situation earlier in the race to get Mark ahead, give him the undercut effectively, and with the final two laps it was entirely the sensible thing to do.

“The last thing you want to see is both of your drivers in the fence which is how that probably would have ended up.

“The message was quite clear to him, what the team expected of him – not what I expected, what the team collectively expected.”

Horner said Webber: “should be fine” with the team orders, adding: “It was crystal clear this morning when we went into the race that it was all about getting the most points we can out of this event.

“Obviously we’ve had a rear jack issue with Sebastian that cost him the track position to Fernando. That’s racing sometimes, these things can happen. Ferrari was quick today, second and third is still a very strong team result

Parity and consistency is needed. Webber knows his place and he races for RedBull. Vettel thinks he owns the team and he needs to be reminded that he is an employee of the team and that in brutal frankness, the only place he could go is McLaren because Ferrari and Mercedes have a better driver than himself, and none of those 3 would play well with each other nor would those two teams need Vettel in the slightest.

I've never actually seen Marko or Horner so annoyed with Vettel, more so than they have ever been with Webber. Management is partly to blame for all this anyway. 2010 they say they would rather lose the title than use team orders. But then they happily sacrifice Webbers championship to trick Ferrari for Vettel. 2011 they enforce team orders, 2012 they enforce team orders. Rightfully so in my opinion, problem is they continually protest that they are 'free to race', when they clearly aren't. Just come out and say Webber is 2nd driver, Vettel 1st. We all know Lewis is 1st driver whether we want to admit it. We all know Alonso is 1st driver whether we want to admit it.

Redbull try and take people for idiots, which is why people have a grievance.

[sportingcp]

"You could clearly see Vettel trying to accelerate past another car in order to make his car go over the finish line first."

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/sport/for ... 3032663802

How dare he? I don´t think Vettel did something THAT wrong to be honest and i´m quite surprised with all the criticism. That was not very correct I agree, but I think almost everyone in his situation would do the same, Webber included. Like it was said already here, Mark already didn´t obey team orders in the past. I think it was more unfair what happened to Rosberg for example. He was faster and the team didn´t let him past. Webber was slower than Vettel and so was passed, simple. But the situation in RB now is seriously very tense. After what happened Sunday i´m pretty sure Webber will leave RB at the end of the season and maybe retire.

[jianh]

I went to the race, and this is one of my shots:

[mikhailv]

Brill picture mate!

[majidasadi]

wow! nice shot!

[donald29]

Bernie says Vettel did the right thing. Said he should have done what Kimi did and said to Horner 'I know what I'm doing'. Show me a good loser and I'll show you a loser Bernie says, Vettel is a winner.

[F1EA]

They should have had Alonso asking the podium questions in Malaysia hehehehe

[donald29]

Apparently Mark Hughes says in his column when Sebastian said 'Mark is too slow' Webber was trying to back him into the Mercedes at that stage. Anyone read the column / can shed any more light on that?

[tderias]

Read that being referred to on PF1. Can't make any sense of it though, I mean why would he do that...

[sugarcube]

Apparently Mark Hughes says in his column when Sebastian said 'Mark is too slow' Webber was trying to back him into the Mercedes at that stage. Anyone read the column / can shed any more light on that?

That's what DC suggested during the race. Following Webber closely, Vettel is facing a risk of being in dirty air and tougher tyre management. Maybe Webber is deliberately pushing Sebastian into the traffic and trying to break his rhythm and strategy.

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2013/03/25/r ... am-orders/

Around lap 26 race engineer Guillaume Rocquelin warned him to drop back: “Try to look after your tyres, you’re too close in the fast corners.”

Meanwhile Webber was being given a lap time target of “high 41s” which he rarely went quicker than, setting a 1’42.5 on lap 27. But Vettel had Hamilton on his tail and was more concerned with overtaking the car in front of him – Webber.

On lap 28 Vettel said: “Mark is too slow, get him out of the way, he’s too slow”. “Understood, look after your tyres,” replied Rocquelin. Shortly afterwards came the confirmation the team would not be imposing any orders just yet: “Sebastian be patient, only half race yet.”

Once the message got delivered to Webber, he immediately speeded up and pulled a gap. Vettel was under serious pressure of Hamilton who was aided by DRS and eventually lost P2 to him around the next pit stop though.

Remember those were delayed team radio and see the gap around the part of the race
Webber vs Vettel: http://en.mclarenf-1.com/index.php?page ... VX-N4FZtkg
Vettel vs Hamilton: http://en.mclarenf-1.com/index.php?page ... VX97YFZtkg

The message should have been worded better though. It's clear that his tone and the phrasing upset a lot of people initially and made them fixated on those than why he issued it. But Vettel had a valid point with the TR.

Read that being referred to on PF1. Can't make any sense of it though, I mean why would he do that...

Teammate or not, Vettel was the biggest threat to the win and I doubt where Vettel would end up was one of Webber's concerns at that stage.

Edit - Don't get me wrong. I wish he hadn't said that at all and he deserves some criticism for that. Surely there are other ways to make his point straight.

OTOH, while understanding they had to be extremely conservative with the tyre management even in the middle of the race, I think stopping their drivers from racing so early and giving the impression that there would be a chance in the later made it harder for Vettel to swallow the team order.

[marcus666]

Well, It doesn't help his hot-headed attitude. Remember Germany 2009:

Button: "Rubens, you're faster than this".

vs

Vettel: "Mark is to slow, get him out of the way."

What sounds better?

I also want to point out why I think many dislike Vettel:

1. He seem to do no mistakes at all unlike everyone else.
2. He had a quite easy career path, 2 years of Toro Rosso with the ending 2008 season as competitive.
3. 2009, Newey gets the regs right, the current and future car are based on the RB5.
4. He's got a hot girlfriend.
5. Everyone thinks he is the best by defeating a former champ car champion.
6. Ten years ago, Mark Webber was the most promising driver. Nowadays, it doesn't get better.
7. His attitude against teammates and also overall (Montreal 2010). There's no calm ever around him.
8. #3 - As said, when a Red Bull dissapears into the horizon, people shut down their television. It's to predictible.

Back in 2002, it was all the same. The only thing I see different, is that both Schumi and Rubens were equal in pace, and Rubens wasn't allowed to race Schumi.
Mark should be able to match Seb, if not, another driver deserves the shot. Abu Dhabi 2012 was one such example.

[naiego]

Best joke I've read for April fool's day!!!!!

http://www.yallaf1.com/2013/04/01/red-b ... hinese-gp/

[mikhailv]

Well, It doesn't help his hot-headed attitude. Remember Germany 2009:

Button: "Rubens, you're faster than this".

vs

Vettel: "Mark is to slow, get him out of the way."

What sounds better?

I also want to point out why I think many dislike Vettel:

1. He seem to do no mistakes at all unlike everyone else.
2. He had a quite easy career path, 2 years of Toro Rosso with the ending 2008 season as competitive.
3. 2009, Newey gets the regs right, the current and future car are based on the RB5.
4. He's got a hot girlfriend.
5. Everyone thinks he is the best by defeating a former champ car champion.
6. Ten years ago, Mark Webber was the most promising driver. Nowadays, it doesn't get better.
7. His attitude against teammates and also overall (Montreal 2010). There's no calm ever around him.
8. #3 - As said, when a Red Bull dissapears into the horizon, people shut down their television. It's to predictible.

Back in 2002, it was all the same. The only thing I see different, is that both Schumi and Rubens were equal in pace, and Rubens wasn't allowed to race Schumi.
Mark should be able to match Seb, if not, another driver deserves the shot. Abu Dhabi 2012 was one such example.

1) Vettel makes plenty of mistakes.
2) Easy career path or not, still drove where he is today even though he isn't the best
3) Totally correct!
4) His girlfriends not that attractive
5) Most people forget Bourdais was in F1. I had to remember who you was onabout!
6) Webber was never the most promising driver on the grid. It was always Kimi and Alonso who were the 'future' boys
7) His attitude never used to stink. Its since he got the chip on his shoulder. I think he believes the 'baby schumi' moniker whereas Schumacher had charm and grace.
8) Yeah, I think thats a probem people have. Especially when it seems like things just fall into place for him, but thats luck and racing for you.

[majidasadi]

Wow! 2.05 seconds for a pit stop!
http://www.planetf1.com/driver/18227/86 ... new-record