This was just an outrageous incident...
Why should Alonso wait stationary in the pits for better spacing and track position (which was his official explanation)? It's better for him to head on track and drive a bit slower, if that's the case. When he's stationary, he's loosing the temprature of his tyres and brakes drastically, as oppose to driving slow on track.
And the way he stayed there for 10 seconds after the lollipop was raised, with no other car going by in the pitlane, it's extremly outrageous... One of the dirtiest things I have ever seen....
And it wasn't too smart of Hamilton to talk that way to Ron Dennis, if indeed he did talk like that. Apparently a decision from inside the team caused that whole situation, and so talking the way he did won't change things for the better, it can only make it worse... Too bad, I really appreciate him as a driver and a sportsman.
I think it was a good decision, to penalize Alonso by 5 positions and to penalize the team in a way, since both Alonso and the team took part of a wrong decision.
2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
Hmm, I have just been think about this some more. Heres a couple of things others may be able to answer:
How would Alonso know what time etc was left? and how would he have known that he needed 10s or whatever to hold up hamilton? [so as he would not have been able to do another lap]
How would he have known that hamilton was coming in behind him?
Alonso would only have the information that the team gave him - so to say Alonso is the only guilty party surely can't be surmised .. Surely ron dennis has knowledge of this happening and what was going on. In my mind no driver would be able to do that without help from the team.
Just a thought ..
Oh, also, I think, from what I have seen, hamiltons attitude after Q3 was very very unprofessional - I think he become a wee bit big for his boots.
How would Alonso know what time etc was left? and how would he have known that he needed 10s or whatever to hold up hamilton? [so as he would not have been able to do another lap]
How would he have known that hamilton was coming in behind him?
Alonso would only have the information that the team gave him - so to say Alonso is the only guilty party surely can't be surmised .. Surely ron dennis has knowledge of this happening and what was going on. In my mind no driver would be able to do that without help from the team.
Just a thought ..
Oh, also, I think, from what I have seen, hamiltons attitude after Q3 was very very unprofessional - I think he become a wee bit big for his boots.
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
After Hamilton realized that he would not be able to make that final lap.lmcsp wrote:
Oh, also, I think, from what I have seen, hamiltons attitude after Q3 was very very unprofessional - I think he become a wee bit big for his boots.
Hamilton first vented his anger to Dennis over his in-car radio. "Don't ****ing do that to me again," he said. Dennis replied: "Don't ****ing talk to me like that," at which Hamilton told him: "Go ****ing swivel."
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
[iceman1 wrote: After Hamilton realized that he would not be able to make that final lap.
Hamilton first vented his anger to Dennis over his in-car radio. "Don't ****ing do that to me again," he said. Dennis replied: "Don't ****ing talk to me like that," at which Hamilton told him: "Go ****ing swivel."
oh new boy ****ing ..he should hv some respect for his uncle ron
After this their will be gr8 tension in mclaren camp :@:2
Alonso is partly responsible... he added few secs!
Team was completely wrong!..no proper real time decision!
Hamilton was just wrong! .against team and teammate!
gr8 chance for quick nick
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Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
Demoted to 6th on the grid and McLaren will not be allowed to score points in the cosntructors championship this race 
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
An era of stupidity is on the horizon...best of luck to KIMI and Felipe!!
The juice is worth the squeeze
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
Now there is going to be great tension at Mclaren between Alonso and Lewis! When the team decide that one of their drivers needs backing up, because they are closer to winning the championship, the other drive would ignore it and go for race victory, something tells me Alonso wont last past the end of this season, or deffently next!
The Essene of Speed is vital. The Precision to Overtake Is Craved. Luck... Is Begged For
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
Fisichella also gets penalty He'll start from 13!
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
well, this is a good way to make people forget a spy scandal. lewis arguing with dennis and dennis accusing lewis? this all thing must be a set up
just a thought
and btw, the stewards say that :
Reference to the circuit map shows that at the time Alonso was told he would be held for 20 seconds there were but 4 cars on the circuit, his own and those of Fisichella, Hamilton and Raikkonen. All but Raikkonen entered the pits such that there can have been no necessity to keep Alonso in the pits for 20 seconds waiting for a convenient gap in traffic in which to leave.
no comment
at least there is an interesting hungarian gp...
ps. : my first post. hello to all the members!
just a thought
and btw, the stewards say that :
Reference to the circuit map shows that at the time Alonso was told he would be held for 20 seconds there were but 4 cars on the circuit, his own and those of Fisichella, Hamilton and Raikkonen. All but Raikkonen entered the pits such that there can have been no necessity to keep Alonso in the pits for 20 seconds waiting for a convenient gap in traffic in which to leave.
no comment
at least there is an interesting hungarian gp...
ps. : my first post. hello to all the members!
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
should make for an interesting start :P, glad maclaren got penalised for making up some bulls** excuse and blaming it on hamilton lol. BMW's FTW
CX2007
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
looking at the track and all the twists and turns .. i think that mclaren have the uppper hand. however after the incident in qualifying betweeen lew and alonso .. kimi could go for the win as he is bak in form
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
I hope too, but don't forget it, Alonso really enjoy this kind of pressure !!!!
Que le meilleur gagne !!!!
Que le meilleur gagne !!!!
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
THE STEWARDS' VERDICT
During the final minutes of qualifying, the car driven by Fernando Alonso remained in its pit stop position at the completion of his pit stop notwithstanding the fact that his team-mate Lewis Hamilton was waiting immediately behind him to commence his own pit stop.
The delay prevented Hamilton from being able to complete his final flying lap of qualifying.
The team principal, together with the team manager and both drivers, were called before the Stewards and asked to explain their actions.
Reference was made to video and audio evidence. The facts and the explanation given by the team are as follows:
At the commencement of the third period of the qualifying practice it had been agreed within the Vodafone McLaren Mercedes Team ("the team") that Fernando Alonso would leave the pit exit ahead of Lewis Hamilton in order to benefit from the possibility for purposes of fuel burn allowance of being able to complete an additional lap.
In the event, the car driven by Lewis Hamilton arrived at the pit exit before that of Fernando Alonso and when the pit lane opened he left in front of Alonso.
The team required Hamilton by radio communication to allow Alonso to pass in order that he might endeavour to complete his extra lap.
Because of the proximity of the Ferrari driven by Kimi Raikkonen, however, Hamilton declined to allow Alonso to pass despite repeated requests from the team to do so.
Reference to the radio communications passing between the team and its two drivers shows that the team told Hamilton at 14:56:44 to "box this lap" and required him to do a "hard in-lap" but advised him some 32 seconds later to "slow the pace a little, just lose a couple of seconds before the end of the lap because Fernando is pitting in front of you".
At 14:57:34, just 18 seconds later, Alonso was told that when he pitted "we are going to hold you for 20 seconds".
At 14:57:46 Alonso's car arrived at his pit stop position, his tyres were changed and the jacks removed just 6 seconds later.
The car then remained in position from 14:57:52 to 14:58:12 when the signal known as the "lollipop" was raised indicating that the driver was free to leave.
By this time Hamilton's car had arrived and stopped immediately behind that of Alonso.
Alonso, instead of leaving his pit in order that his team-mate Hamilton could complete his pit stop, remained in position for a further 10 seconds.
He then left the pit lane in sufficient time to reach the Control Line before the end of qualifying, completed a flying lap in which he set the fastest time and secured pole position.
Because of the delay caused by Alonso, Hamilton was unable to complete his pit stop in time sufficient to enable him also to complete a flying lap.
The team were asked to explain why, having indicated to Hamilton that he must stop at his pit on the next lap, they then informed Alonso whilst he was still on the track that when he also pitted on the next lap he would be held for 20 seconds.
The team stated that they frequently give estimates as to duration of pit stop to their drivers before they pit and that the reason the car was in fact held for 20 seconds was that it was being counted down prior to release at a beneficial time regard being given to other cars on the track.
Alonso was asked why he waited for some 10 seconds before leaving the pits after being given the signal to leave. His response was that he was enquiring as to whether the correct set of tyres had been fitted to his car.
When asked why this conversation did not take place during the 20-second period when his car sat stationary all work on it having been completed, it was stated that it was not possible to communicate by radio because of the countdown being given to him.
Reference to the circuit map shows that at the time Alonso was told he would be held for 20 seconds there were but 4 cars on the circuit, his own and those of Fisichella, Hamilton and Raikkonen.
All but Raikkonen entered the pits such that there can have been no necessity to keep Alonso in the pits for 20 seconds waiting for a convenient gap in traffic in which to leave.
The explanation given by Alonso as to why at the expiration of the 20 second period he remained in his pit stop position for a further 10 seconds is not accepted.
The Stewards find that he unnecessarily impeded another driver, Hamilton, and as a result he will be penalised by a loss of 5 grid positions.
The explanation given by the team as to why they kept Alonso stationary for 20 seconds after completion of his tyre change and therefore delayed Hamilton's own pit stop is not accepted.
The actions of the team in the final minutes of qualifying are considered prejudicial to the interests of the competition and to the interests of motor sport generally.
The penalty to be applied is that such points (if any) in the 2007 Formula 1 constructors' championship as accrue to the team as a result of their participation in the 2007 Hungarian Grand Prix wilt be withdrawn.
The team is reminded of its right of appeal.
During the final minutes of qualifying, the car driven by Fernando Alonso remained in its pit stop position at the completion of his pit stop notwithstanding the fact that his team-mate Lewis Hamilton was waiting immediately behind him to commence his own pit stop.
The delay prevented Hamilton from being able to complete his final flying lap of qualifying.
The team principal, together with the team manager and both drivers, were called before the Stewards and asked to explain their actions.
Reference was made to video and audio evidence. The facts and the explanation given by the team are as follows:
At the commencement of the third period of the qualifying practice it had been agreed within the Vodafone McLaren Mercedes Team ("the team") that Fernando Alonso would leave the pit exit ahead of Lewis Hamilton in order to benefit from the possibility for purposes of fuel burn allowance of being able to complete an additional lap.
In the event, the car driven by Lewis Hamilton arrived at the pit exit before that of Fernando Alonso and when the pit lane opened he left in front of Alonso.
The team required Hamilton by radio communication to allow Alonso to pass in order that he might endeavour to complete his extra lap.
Because of the proximity of the Ferrari driven by Kimi Raikkonen, however, Hamilton declined to allow Alonso to pass despite repeated requests from the team to do so.
Reference to the radio communications passing between the team and its two drivers shows that the team told Hamilton at 14:56:44 to "box this lap" and required him to do a "hard in-lap" but advised him some 32 seconds later to "slow the pace a little, just lose a couple of seconds before the end of the lap because Fernando is pitting in front of you".
At 14:57:34, just 18 seconds later, Alonso was told that when he pitted "we are going to hold you for 20 seconds".
At 14:57:46 Alonso's car arrived at his pit stop position, his tyres were changed and the jacks removed just 6 seconds later.
The car then remained in position from 14:57:52 to 14:58:12 when the signal known as the "lollipop" was raised indicating that the driver was free to leave.
By this time Hamilton's car had arrived and stopped immediately behind that of Alonso.
Alonso, instead of leaving his pit in order that his team-mate Hamilton could complete his pit stop, remained in position for a further 10 seconds.
He then left the pit lane in sufficient time to reach the Control Line before the end of qualifying, completed a flying lap in which he set the fastest time and secured pole position.
Because of the delay caused by Alonso, Hamilton was unable to complete his pit stop in time sufficient to enable him also to complete a flying lap.
The team were asked to explain why, having indicated to Hamilton that he must stop at his pit on the next lap, they then informed Alonso whilst he was still on the track that when he also pitted on the next lap he would be held for 20 seconds.
The team stated that they frequently give estimates as to duration of pit stop to their drivers before they pit and that the reason the car was in fact held for 20 seconds was that it was being counted down prior to release at a beneficial time regard being given to other cars on the track.
Alonso was asked why he waited for some 10 seconds before leaving the pits after being given the signal to leave. His response was that he was enquiring as to whether the correct set of tyres had been fitted to his car.
When asked why this conversation did not take place during the 20-second period when his car sat stationary all work on it having been completed, it was stated that it was not possible to communicate by radio because of the countdown being given to him.
Reference to the circuit map shows that at the time Alonso was told he would be held for 20 seconds there were but 4 cars on the circuit, his own and those of Fisichella, Hamilton and Raikkonen.
All but Raikkonen entered the pits such that there can have been no necessity to keep Alonso in the pits for 20 seconds waiting for a convenient gap in traffic in which to leave.
The explanation given by Alonso as to why at the expiration of the 20 second period he remained in his pit stop position for a further 10 seconds is not accepted.
The Stewards find that he unnecessarily impeded another driver, Hamilton, and as a result he will be penalised by a loss of 5 grid positions.
The explanation given by the team as to why they kept Alonso stationary for 20 seconds after completion of his tyre change and therefore delayed Hamilton's own pit stop is not accepted.
The actions of the team in the final minutes of qualifying are considered prejudicial to the interests of the competition and to the interests of motor sport generally.
The penalty to be applied is that such points (if any) in the 2007 Formula 1 constructors' championship as accrue to the team as a result of their participation in the 2007 Hungarian Grand Prix wilt be withdrawn.
The team is reminded of its right of appeal.
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
Lewis's car is the fastest It seems that Ferrai's cars are not suitable for Hungarian GP,
...I AM Ready.. :@:2
...I AM Ready.. :@:2
Re: 2007 Formula 1 Hungary GP
Obviously both the team and Alonso are to blame, that's why I believe penalizing Alonso and Mclaren seperately is a good solution.lmcsp wrote:Hmm, I have just been think about this some more. Heres a couple of things others may be able to answer:
How would Alonso know what time etc was left? and how would he have known that he needed 10s or whatever to hold up hamilton? [so as he would not have been able to do another lap]
How would he have known that hamilton was coming in behind him?
Alonso would only have the information that the team gave him - so to say Alonso is the only guilty party surely can't be surmised .. Surely ron dennis has knowledge of this happening and what was going on. In my mind no driver would be able to do that without help from the team.
Just a thought ..
Oh, also, I think, from what I have seen, hamiltons attitude after Q3 was very very unprofessional - I think he become a wee bit big for his boots.
As to how could he know that Hamilton was coming behind him - It had to be info from the team again, and after a while he could see him in his rear-view mirrors...
And again, indeed totally inappropriate behaviour from Hamilton. He should have kept it cool in front of the media, and then solve this problem behind closed doors, inside the team. He shouldn't have let out his frustration to the media like that, especially when it's deliberated against his team. This might be remmembered to him at a later stage of the season, like in the last race, and it can affect the team's decision and strategy, if it ever comes down to that stage.