£40m Budget Cap and Controversies

[Ali]

If Toyota go it won't be a loss - they've brought nothing to F1

Wrong! They've brought train.

[JoostLamers]

If Toyota go it won't be a loss - they've brought nothing to F1

Wrong! They've brought train.

Yeah, the Trulli train

[Ali]

Q: What is your stance on the FIA budget cap proposal? Brawn GP is already a team in the process of slimming down…
Ross Brawn: We as a team always supported the idea of the budget cap, but what we don’t want is a budget cap that forces other teams to leave Formula One. Is there another solution to the budget cap that can achieve the same objectives and be acceptable to teams like Ferrari, Toyota and so on? If we can find such a solution then we get the best of both, so we are not fixed on the budget cap being the only solution. We proposed a budget cap already last year but having a budget cap that forces other teams to rethink their commitment to Formula One would be a great shame. I hope we can avoid that.

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http://www.formula1.com/news/interviews/2009/5/9370.html

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There was this interesting talk about the budget cap just one year ago. Here is a recap of what was happened:

A budget cap is set to be introduced in the sport from the start of 2009, and FIA consultant Tony Purnell has written to all Formula One teams with the figures the governing body would like to be set as a starting point for future discussions. The figures proposed are 175 million Euro for 2009, 140 million by 2010, and 110 million a year later. The cap would not cover expenditure on engines, KERS systems, marketing costs or driver and team principal salaries.

Honda's reaction:
"Next year's figures are workable, but Honda is a little concerned about the glide-path, which needs more discussion. By pushing the number too low, we may not only attract marginal operations but also alienate those at the top who want to develop high technology."

Renault's reaction:
"I already pay 40 per cent less than the cap. If I want to keep to the limit then I need to spend more. It's nonsense. Formula One is part of the environment and the economical situation and the sponsors, the manufacturers - we are part of the economical world. Maybe not today or tomorrow but surely in the future it will affect us. F1 needs to be competitive, F1 is a better show and less investment and costs less."

Toyota's stance:
"It's a very broad discussion, you can achieve anything. The one issue is how low the FIA wants it to go over time and the impact on people's livelihoods. That's the biggest concern I have. I think in the end it can be enforced. The real issue is whether business becomes more healthy when you have a controlled environment: normally competition is better for business. So my worry to some extent that it will have a negative effect. If you put businesses into a non-competitive environment and say from a point of view of business, I'm not personally convinced it's the right thing to do."

McLaren's [retired] opinion:
"I don't see a budget cap as a regulatory process more the application of common sense. I don't think it's a question of enforceability but if there's a general ability to control costs when you've got the complicity of companies that have their R&D facilities in other countries where these programmes are in very difficult to understand languages and documents. I just have concerns you can monitor costs if you're policing them in Germany or China or Japan. How can you do that? We embrace anything that reduces the costs of F1 as long as it can be practically evaluated."

BMW:
"In principle we have always supported the budget cap instead of individual technical restrictions because very simply if you want to save money you should limit money and not something else. So in our view this is a very valid approach, you can always argue about the figure then, but the principle of going to a budget cut and allowing the teams to spend the money in areas they think will make them competitive, is something we would approve."

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http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/67410

[TwistedArmco]

I think modern F1 has been moulded and built around Manufacturers and the like. If you think of the audience now days, it is alot more stronger than it used to be. Williams, McLaren and Ferrari are a big part of F1, but for the past 20 years.. well, 16 years, renault both as Manufacturer and Engine suplier have been important, BMW has invested alot and brought some great talent in.

Redbull would be missed heavily, because there marketing and so forth has brought alot of people, but its also the F1 atmosphere; theyve brought a hell of alot to F1. One could argue toyota bring nothing, but what will the Japanese/Chinese viewing figures be like should there be no japanese in the field? Kazuki is part of the Toyota deal at william,s if they pull their engine goes too, so it would presumable be Hulkenberg, and a new engine supplier.

What, so you're arguing that if some/all of the manufacturors left F1, people would just stop viewing?? I think to an extent you're right, but that's only the idiots who only support a team and don't really like the sport, if you like, the casual viewer. I think that if a couple of minor ones left, it would hurt no-one at all. F1 neds to be more made up of indie teams.

The car manufacturors stagnated it from 2000-, and now just as its getting interesting, with more privateer teams threatening to show up among new rules, the manufacturors throw a fit?? It's stupid!! It's not their sport, all they have to do is build a car under a budget cap and spend less, not try and dictate which direction the sport goes. Trying to dominate the entire sport through quit threats is pathetic!! Ferrari leaving would be a massive loss, but if they think the whole sport revolves around them, then they can get the hell away from it, and they deserve to be gone. As far as I can tell, Ferrari are the only team which utterly protests to the budget cap, as opposed to the two-tier system. If so, then they are alone in their pig-headedness.

We will see what happens, but authority is authority and Ferrari can't act like spoilt brats forever.

[Jaguar]

Ferrari to Leave or not to ?

Spoiler:

Ferrari boss does not deny Alonso rumours

Stefano Domenicali has refused to deny persistent speculation that Fernando Alonso's future is with the Ferrari team.

Italian Domenicali, 44, is the team boss of the Maranello outfit, which according to strong paddock rumours has already reached some sort of agreement to unite a red car with the double world champion in 2010 or 2011.

At a sponsor event with 2010 Ferrari backer Santander's chief Emilio Botin earlier this week, 27-year-old Alonso spoke glowingly about the prestige of driving for the famous Scuderia in F1.

And he added: "I like winning and having the best car, and Ferrari has proved that it always has one of the best."

On the way to Monaco this week, a reporter for the Spanish newspaper AS spotted and chatted with Domenicali on a flight from Madrid to Nice.

Domenicali was asked what he thought of Alonso's comments about Ferrari, and answered: "Me piace, me piace (I like, I like)."

"He is a driver 'bravissimo'," he added. And as for whether Alonso is destined to move to Ferrari, Domenicali said wryly: "We will see, we will see."

omg now come on decide already !

and plus Alonso have had a meeting with Red Bull Team 2 years ago and he said he would like to join the team but he wants a short contract with 'em (1-2 seasons max) meanwhile Horner said we want Alonso for a long term contract (5-6 seasons) and he refused ... now Red Bull is among the top teams and i guess he regrets it (well red bull was a good car last season but , the Renault powere in the back of the car was not good )

[JoostLamers]

Three teams confirm budget cap support

Spoiler:

Three team chiefs on Thursday said they would welcome the imposition of a budget cap in 2010 and beyond.

With five of their rivals clearly threatening to quit over the dispute with FIA President Max Mosley, Williams, Force India and even BMW said setting a maximum expenditure limit would be acceptable.

Mercedes-Benz, too, has already explained its desire to find an agreement with F1's governing body rather than threaten to quit.

"We are clearly wholly in support of it (a budget cap)," said Sir Frank Williams, co-owner and team principal of the famous and historically successful Oxfordshire based team.

"It suits us," he insisted, adding that a ‘glide path’ for hugely funded rivals like Ferrari and Toyota may be necessary.

"To expect a major manufacturer to slash its spending by 300 percent in four months is a very tall fiscal order," Williams acknowledged in Monaco.

Mario Theissen, boss of BMW's Hinwil-based BMW Sauber team, also sounded supportive of the push for budget caps, or an alternative to be discussed by the FOTA alliance on Friday.

It is believed that BMW's previous objection was of the proposed 'two-tier' regulations, which Mosley has already agreed to discard.

"I think whatever we do, if it's a monetary figure or if it's another form to cut resources, we have to police it and I think it can be policed," the German said.

"If we were not convinced it can be policed we wouldn't expend any effort on it but I think it can be done with a bit of good will on all sides and the right spirit. It can be done," added Theissen.

Vijay Mallya, owner and Team Principal of the Force India team, also backed the move.

"Whether you call it a budget cap or call it a targeted amount to be spent, that is very, very essential or else the small independent teams will never be able to compete with those who have, in comparison, extraordinary budgets," he said.

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http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/090521220656.shtml

[Zack]

I think Ferrari should go ... concentrate on Le-Mans or A1GP(almost already Ferrari series) or Ferrari 1

It will be epic! Only one will survive Ferrari or F1

[phil1993]

I think Ferrari should go ... concentrate on Le-Mans or A1GP(almost already Ferrari series) or Ferrari 1

It will be epic! Only one will survive Ferrari or F1

Makes me laugh that Ferrari are interested in LeMans where there are several tiers of racing, something they want to avoid in F1

[Zack]

I think Ferrari should go ... concentrate on Le-Mans or A1GP(almost already Ferrari series) or Ferrari 1

It will be epic! Only one will survive Ferrari or F1

Makes me laugh that Ferrari are interested in LeMans where there are several tiers of racing, something they want to avoid in F1

But you know whole concept is different & classic

[phil1993]

I think Ferrari should go ... concentrate on Le-Mans or A1GP(almost already Ferrari series) or Ferrari 1

It will be epic! Only one will survive Ferrari or F1

Makes me laugh that Ferrari are interested in LeMans where there are several tiers of racing, something they want to avoid in F1

But you know whole concept is different & classic

True, although F1 is classic: look what race we're at... Ferrari won't go, Toyota and Renault might because of poor results and directors back in Japan/France not seeing a future or heritage but Ferrari will stay, especially with the fan support they have, as well as pretty much the 3rd best driver combo on the grid

[Zack]

I think Ferrari should go ... concentrate on Le-Mans or A1GP(almost already Ferrari series) or Ferrari 1

It will be epic! Only one will survive Ferrari or F1

Makes me laugh that Ferrari are interested in LeMans where there are several tiers of racing, something they want to avoid in F1

But you know whole concept is different & classic

True, although F1 is classic: look what race we're at... Ferrari won't go, Toyota and Renault might because of poor results and directors back in Japan/France not seeing a future or heritage but Ferrari will stay, especially with the fan support they have, as well as pretty much the 3rd best driver combo on the grid

It's more about gunning down there internal resources to win & to be competitive ..rule are such you can't win without exercising budget cap! Ferrari will never agree on $40m ...clear bye bye this time

[phil1993]

Yeah, but they'll increase it to £80m-100m

[Zack]

$200m to $300m looks feasible ..that's roughly $120m reduction compare to previous years.

[phil1993]

I think they'll settle on something around $120m-140m, as thats the budget of some lower teams, whilst its a feasible number for Ferrari to reduce to (from $275m)

[AzShadow]

Ecclestone warns of legal action against Ferrari

In a move which will surely help the current situation, Bernie Ecclestone has warned that he might sue Ferrari if it walks away from F1 as it is threatening to do.

Under the terms of the old Concorde Agreement of 2005, Ferrari is contractually committed to F1 until 2012, as are all the other teams that signed up at that time.

"We would always respect our contracts," Ecclestone told reporters in Monaco. "All the teams that have signed contracts with us would expect us to respect them and we would expect the same from Ferrari. They are saying they are going to walk, we are saying we hope they respect their contract."

However, the Italian team was quick to react, a spokesman telling reporters: "We are not worried. The (French) court recognised the validity of the Concorde Agreement and we are now deciding whether or not to continue with our legal action. We are hoping it will not come to this and that we can find a way forward.

"But ultimately, if the Concorde Agreement is binding, then the FIA broke it when they changed the sporting rules without respecting the agreed procedures," he added, "which state that only the F1 Commission can do so."

F1's last years might end in court battles rather than in battles on the track.