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Which penalty do you think fitted for the race in Valencia today?
1) Yes for 5 second penalty 17%  17%  [ 4 ]
2) No for 5 second penalty 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
3) Penalties should be handed out during the race 71%  71%  [ 17 ]
4) Penalties should be investigated after the race 13%  13%  [ 3 ]
Total votes : 24
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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 30 Jun 2010, 06:46  
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And to add to the above, it isn't the drivers on the track who decides when and when not the other drivers should go and take their penalty - it never has been like that.

Many times a drive-through penalty has been served after several laps, the team calls them in at some point.

This was just so disappointing all and all, these accusations and outbursts :(

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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 30 Jun 2010, 07:37  
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swca92 wrote:
The more I look at the replay the more convinced I am that Hamilton deliberately slowed down Alonso to try and gethim stuck behind the safety car while staying ahead of it himself. Just an opinion, please don't shoot me.

We'll never know.

Personally I think he was on the radio, asking where's the SC (line), what are the rules, etc...

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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 30 Jun 2010, 08:34  
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swca92 wrote:
The more I look at the replay the more convinced I am that Hamilton deliberately slowed down Alonso to try and gethim stuck behind the safety car while staying ahead of it himself. Just an opinion, please don't shoot me.



Well, if that is true, it is a nice payback for holding Hammy up at hungary's qualifying in 2008 :zz:
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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 30 Jun 2010, 11:08  
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It is! But I think this whole incident is blown up so much. In my opinion it was just an incident. Hamilton crossed the SC-line just maybe one second too late. He got a drive through penalty for it and that's it. Alonso was unlucky to get stuck behind traffic. And Hamilton was lucky to be in free air, so that he could push to get him some space for the penalty. It's not Hamilton's fault he managed to retain second place. I think he did a good job to make the best out of the situation. Alonso was just very unlucky. But that's part of the sport. Sometimes you're lucky, sometimes not.
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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2010, 16:27  
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shailf1 wrote:
i think what they are trying to say is that following the rules is slower than breaking the rule.
for example a guy overtakes the safety car and laps everyone and then gets a drive thru penalty. gains around 90 sec and loses around 15 sec.

Hi folks, I followed the discussion and I say that's the real point to put on the right focus. I think shailf1 is completely right, we had various examples of that in recentl times Current penalty regulations aren't effective against rules breaking and unfair behaviours because gains and losses are widely unbalanced too often. I think it's part of pre-race team strategy to play some borderline or unfair tricks and see what's going to happen then, because it pays off.

Considering that, I'm pretty sure that Lewis deliberately decided to overtake the SC after considering of not doing that: if you look the onboard replay you can see he gradually slowed down approaching the SC, then re-accelerated to overtake, but the SC had already crossed the white line. I don't say he slowed down deliberalely the amount of time needed to stuck both Ferraris behind the SC (I hope he isn't that clever...) but IMO he knew very well he couldn't overtake but he did it anyway to minimize his time lost. Then the Stewards showed they weren't up to the task at all; they can't wait for a team radio to discover they had something to investigate on about a race they had to control.

Last thing to say (beg your patience...) I think is unacceptable that professional drivers and World Champions had to wait for a pit radio comm to know what they had to do in a race, how many moves they could do to defend a position, how to behave behind a SC, etc. They HAD to know well the rulebook to drive in a F1 race, as we had to know well road rules to drive our family car. If it's not the case, they had to study!

By the way, when the SC was deployed Hamilton lapped his in lap in about 2min 11sec , the other drivers weren't slowed by the SC too and lapped around 2min 15sec after their pitstop, Alonso went to the pits at SC pace and lapped over 2m 40sec and Massa over 2min 50sec; that definitely ruined their race.

Quite unpleasant.... :roll::

:wave:


Last edited by Lomo on 02 Jul 2010, 16:30, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2010, 16:29  
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I haven't been paying much attention to this article ever since i wrote it sorry, thanks for all your insightful veiws.
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 Post subject: Re: Stewards and their ridiculous decisions
PostPosted: 02 Jul 2010, 16:41  
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The Blur wrote:
phil1993 wrote:
The Blur wrote:
I might be slow


*Looks at location*

Ah, its okay, we understand

:p


:lol:
I'll use the only response I know I can... 4-1! :wave:


Hahahahaha! Brilliant The blur absolutely brilliant!
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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 09 Jul 2010, 21:06  
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Here is what Leo Turrini has to say, he is a sport reporter in Italy for three magazines but has his blog where he writes openly about his likes and dislikes and also brings inside information since he has ties to Maranello:

F1, The Penguin's revenge
http://club.quotidiano.net/turrini/f1_l ... l_pinguino

Published by Leo Turrini Mon, 05/07/2010 - 22:25

Quote:
Never underestimate the Penguin. The Penguin is not only the historical enemy of Batman together with the Joker. He is also, in a spectacular reincarnation, the chairman of Modern International Automobile Federation.

Well, the Penguin is Jean Todt.

Well, the bubbly person has decided, as I understand it, to put the record straight.

How?

A mega-super summit dedicated to the problems which affected the race at Valencia in terms of the safety car will be held on Wednesday at Silverstone.

I was told that after the noisy complaints that it wasn't Cola (who hates the Penguin), it was Alonso who had phoned the Penguin.

The number +39,451 and the rest was dialled.

The Penguin has clearly stated to Tuft Kid, also known as Luca Cordero di Montezemolo, that Ferrari's attitude was intolerable.

Tuft replied that something in the rules, however, was unclear.

The Penguin pointed out that the Horse had blatantly complained over what happened in Valencia.

Tuft asked the Penguin to give a hand to his (Ferrari's) employees by making an immediate clarification.

In return the Penguin got an apology, more or less formal, from Alonso. I have found no trace of it anywhere.

At Maranello someone begins to suspect that the Penguin, for mysterious reasons, is trying to burn the earth around the poor Sun, also known as Stefano Domenicali.

Not forgetting of course the historical hostility the Penguin has against Fernando Alonso.

We will talk about that.

Take care.

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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 09 Jul 2010, 23:39  
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Wolfie wrote:
Here is what Leo Turrini has to say, he is a sport reporter in Italy for three magazines but has his blog where he writes openly about his likes and dislikes and also brings inside information since he has ties to Maranello:

F1, The Penguin's revenge
http://club.quotidiano.net/turrini/f1_l ... l_pinguino

Published by Leo Turrini Mon, 05/07/2010 - 22:25

Quote:
Never underestimate the Penguin. The Penguin is not only the historical enemy of Batman together with the Joker. He is also, in a spectacular reincarnation, the chairman of Modern International Automobile Federation.

Well, the Penguin is Jean Todt.

Well, the bubbly person has decided, as I understand it, to put the record straight.

How?

A mega-super summit dedicated to the problems which affected the race at Valencia in terms of the safety car will be held on Wednesday at Silverstone.

I was told that after the noisy complaints that it wasn't Cola (who hates the Penguin), it was Alonso who had phoned the Penguin.

The number +39,451 and the rest was dialled.

The Penguin has clearly stated to Tuft Kid, also known as Luca Cordero di Montezemolo, that Ferrari's attitude was intolerable.

Tuft replied that something in the rules, however, was unclear.

The Penguin pointed out that the Horse had blatantly complained over what happened in Valencia.

Tuft asked the Penguin to give a hand to his (Ferrari's) employees by making an immediate clarification.

In return the Penguin got an apology, more or less formal, from Alonso. I have found no trace of it anywhere.

At Maranello someone begins to suspect that the Penguin, for mysterious reasons, is trying to burn the earth around the poor Sun, also known as Stefano Domenicali.

Not forgetting of course the historical hostility the Penguin has against Fernando Alonso.

We will talk about that.

Take care.


I looked at the word Penguin and i got lost.

But thanks i managed to reread as i was half asleep :shhh:
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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 17 Jul 2010, 06:24  
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Haha,
Check out this report which came out in Autosport couple of hours back.
Now I rest my case when it comes to FIA politics against Ferrari. =)

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/85320

Ferrari 'not asked' to let Kubica pass

By Jonathan Noble and Michele Lostia Friday, July 16th 2010, 17:44 GMT


Ferrari was not given an immediate order by the FIA for Fernando Alonso to give back his position to Robert Kubica at Silverstone, according to newly-published information relating to the pit wall radio conversations that took place during the British Grand Prix.

FIA race director Charlie Whiting told Italian magazine Autosprint earlier this week that he advised Ferrari straight away to let Kubica retake his position from Alonso.

However, according to a detailed report in Gazzetta dello Sport today, the team's version of events is very different.

Massimo Rivola, Ferrari's team manager, told the newspaper: "This is not polemics, these are elements to clarify why Ferrari made certain decisions and the logic behind them, after Alonso's move on Kubica."

According to Gazzetta dello Sport, this is the chronology of the events from Ferrari's perspective.

13:31:05 The overtaking move takes place at Club and after one second Rivola calls Whiting, who replies after 11 seconds. Rivola asks: 'Have you seen the pass? In our opinion there was no room to overtake.'

26 secs after the pass, Whiting asks to be given time to watch the TV footage.

13:33 Ferrari makes a second radio call - 1m55s after the pass. Alonso has completed another lap plus one sector, and is behind Nico Rosberg and Jaime Alguersuari, while Kubica drops further back.

Whiting tells Ferrari that the stewards think Alonso could give the position back. Rivola asks: 'Is this the decision?'

Whiting replies: 'No, but that's how we see it.'

Rivola informs the team while Rosberg overtakes Alguersuari. On the GPS screen that shows the position of the cars, Ferrari sees Kubica dropping further back. Meanwhile, Alonso overtakes Alguersuari at Turn 2.

13:33:22 Ferrari makes a third radio call.

Rivola tells Whiting: 'Alonso doesn't have only Kubica behind. He would have to concede two positions now.'

While they discuss the matter Kubica is overtaken by Barrichello so Alonso would have to now give up three positions.

Whiting replies: 'We have given you the chance to do it or not. Things being this way, the stewards will hear the drivers at the end of the race, but I understand your position.'

13:35:30 Kubica stops so Alonso can no longer give the position back.

13:45:31 The stewards investigate the Alonso/Kubica incident. The monitors then display 'car number 8 under investigation', 14m26s after the pass.

13:46:26 Just 55 seconds later the stewards decide that Alonso should have a drive-through penalty.
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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 19 Jul 2010, 22:22  
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Weird case. Eighter Ferrari or the FIA are wrong. But one thing is sure. Whatever Ferrari may say or think, it doesn't affect the outcome of the race. In the end the FIA will always winn. If this is fair, that's a second matter. In any case, Alonso has been very unlucky the past few races.
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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 20 Jul 2010, 06:32  
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An Italian newspaper (Gazzetta dello Sport at that...) backing up Ferrari. Well I never...

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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 20 Jul 2010, 20:27  
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phil1993 wrote:
An Italian newspaper (Gazzetta dello Sport at that...) backing up Ferrari. Well I never...


Gazetta Dello Sport are backing up Ferrari?? Suprising..... :p
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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 27 Jul 2010, 20:42  
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:shhh:

Quote:
The betting-agencies are furious at Ferrari

27.07.2010 15:56

Irish betting agency Paddy Power told that they returned 18 500 euros (15 000 pounds) to people who placed a bet for Felipe Massa in Hockenheim GP.

- We didn't shoot ourself in the leg, someone else go us to this situation. The person betting doesn't accuse F1. He accuses us for taking his/her money, Paddy Power announced.

SBOBET:s manager Bill Mummery accuses the F1-bosses for abandoning their own rules when they didn't cancel Alonso's victory.

- This is not only unfair to the sport, it's also unfair to the audience who pay huge amount of tickets and betting, Mummery tells.

(MTV3)
http://www.mtv3.fi/urheilu/f1/uutiset.s ... 07/1160796

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 Post subject: Re: Stewards decisions | Ferrari could face FIA sanctions
PostPosted: 27 Jul 2010, 20:43  
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Quote:
Ferrari might get rid of Smedley
Published by Leo Turrini Mon, 26/07/2010 - 15:00

So, today was and still is a very busy day in Ferrari. As you know it isn't easy try and close the stable door after the horse already is on the run, however they are laughably trying. Here is some valuable information for you.

1) Tuft Kid, also known as Luca Cordero di Montezemolo, believes that the pitwall acted wisely. And he is furious over the way the story was dealt with at the level of communication even though he does not say it .

2) It's incredible in fact what happened during and immediately after the race. The way in which Smedley warns Massa ('Fernando is faster than you, confirm that you understand this message') seems to have been as if he was an enemy of the horse and wanted to slag the horse and that's why he expressed and acted in that manner.

3) It would be interesting to know why Stefano Domenicali didn't see it fit to use his own voice to Felipe. Maybe he was a victim of a sudden attack of hoarseness?

4) It is possible that Smedley leaves for some period of time before the Hungarian Grand Prix to learn how to say 'sorry' on live broadcast worldwide. And I wouldn't be surprised if the Ferrari garage had some more news on Sunday in Hungary

5) The leaders in Ferrari believe - again without saying so - that the management afterwards was disastrous. The declarations have assured the entire world press (except for Italy) that the Spaniard Alonso is driver #1. In Italy they know it. How did they treat Schumacher and Todt? Absolute c**p, shame, and media lynching. Will they treat Dom and Alonso in the same way? Well good, down with hypocrisy and so on. Same names, same faces, and so on. And Domenicali's post race conference was dreadful.

6) However, the FIA World Council will not decide a thing. How could they? The FIA president is the Penguin, alias Jean Todt, the man of Zeltweg. If he does then he will give a champion a free ride between other drivers? Like in that movie 'Back to the Future 4'?

7) It's clear that in terms of image Ferrari can't continue this way. In one thing Montezemolo was absolutely right: in Germany we saw a fantastic car, for the first time this season the Red Army was unbeatable but the slaughtering news are about the pitwall. It has also brought the idea that Banco Santander Alonso has bought the team. You can tell your friend Briatore at Renault that 'It's ridiculous', now we don't know if Ferrari is still Ferrari and not a branch of a bank.

8) Massa came out well from this story. He was allowed to play bad if he follows the script to the end. But for someone to accuse him of not understanding it first and not giving the position to Fernando spontaneously, come on..... it's an insult to people's intelligence and loyalty.

9) Briatore didn't go to Ferrari for nothing. Schumacher didn't leave Ferrari for nothing. Even the Penguin didn't leave Ferrari for nothing. God creates them and pairs them with motorsport.

10) Take care and reason with your head, boys and girls.

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