Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

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Who was to blame?

Sebastian Vettel
20
61%
Mark Webber
7
21%
Both
6
18%
 
Total votes: 33

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swca92
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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by swca92 » 01 Jun 2010, 16:44

Surprised no one has mentioned what happened at Fuji 2007 - not only did that get their relationship off on a bad start but showed Vettel was/still is capable of errors and is still relatively inexperienced.

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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by phil1993 » 01 Jun 2010, 16:47

swca92 wrote:Surprised no one has mentioned what happened at Fuji 2007 - not only did that get their relationship off on a bad start but showed Vettel was/still is capable of errors and is still relatively inexperienced.


Thats a little more understandable because that was only his 6th or 7th race. But after 50 races, making a move like that (not for the first time this season or even the first time that race) is not something you can let him off with.

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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by Ferrariman60 » 01 Jun 2010, 19:57

It was all pretty plain and simple to me. Vettel went for a gap that really wasn't there. He knew that he needed to get over to the right for the braking zone, and just couldn't pull off the move fast enough. If he had been a little closer to Webber out of turn 10, I think he could have pulled it off in time for braking for 12, but he simply ran out of road and reacted the wrong way.
Requiescat in pace, Jules Bianchi


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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by iceman1 » 01 Jun 2010, 20:03

Dyed-in-the-wool racer Martin Brundle on Monday said he sees no quick end to Red Bull’s new self-induced crisis.

"I doubt that trip across the Atlantic for the next round in Montreal will extinguish these fireworks," the BBC commentator said on Monday, as the international media got to work on Sebastian Vettel’s crash at Istanbul Park with race leader and teammate Mark Webber.

The Sun’s headline referred to the one-two gift handed to McLaren, toying with the energy drink’s slogan by insisting "Red Bull gives you wins".

Other sections of the press were more serious.

"Red Bull has a conflict of jealously and betrayal," said El Mundo newspaper in Spain.

Italy’s La Repubblica likened the previously dominant team’s self-destruction to "suicide".

Britain’s The Independent referred to the fact that Webber, branded crazy by Vettel’s gesticulations and told by his bosses that he should have let the young German past, must now have the impression he is the number two driver.

Webber acknowledged that Vettel’s gesticulations were caused by the "adrenalin" of the moment, but "Red Bull need to take steps to ensure the current world championship leader can have complete faith that the support within the team is spread evenly", said the newspaper.

And Germany’s Auto Motor und Sport noted that the 33-year-old is "not the kind of guy who is told to finish second".

Strangely within the paddock, it was only the Red Bull bosses who thought Webber had done something wrong.

"Where should Mark have gone?" Lewis Hamilton - who had a box-seat view of the incident that unfolded in front of him - told German television Sky.

"I think the gap he left him was big enough.

"Even though Jenson and I both want to win, we also have respect for each other. I’m really happy that I have such a good relationship with my teammate."

Said Mercedes’ Nico Rosberg: "Mark didn’t move at all. For me, it was clearly Sebastian’s fault."

Niki Lauda said the 22-year-old had been "much too aggressive", and former driver Alex Wurz noted in Turkey: "All my racing colleagues are in agreement that it was Vettel’s fault."

Ross Brawn thinks these situations can be minimised if drivers know clearly the rules of engagement.

"It depends on what has been said beforehand," the Mercedes team boss is quoted by Die Welt newspaper. "Although it’s racing, the rules must be known to the drivers."

Peter Sauber, meanwhile, had some sympathy for Christian Horner, admitting to Blick newspaper in Switzerland that these situations are "a nightmare for a team chief".


@NobleF1 : Red Bull Racing's website has just crashed my machine. Whose fault is it - Webber or Vettel? :lol: :lol:

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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by JoostLamers » 02 Jun 2010, 07:29

swca92 wrote:Surprised no one has mentioned what happened at Fuji 2007 - not only did that get their relationship off on a bad start but showed Vettel was/still is capable of errors and is still relatively inexperienced.

Of course he keeps making mistakes, don't forget he's still incredibly young!
<<<The flag Lew1s waved at
Image


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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by gothebulls » 02 Jun 2010, 13:43

a little less gesticulation a little less hypocritical action you young punk. i want nothing more than vettel to be webber's team mate given his speed, but these choices are nothing more than the actions of a prima donna. where is his team focus?

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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by R.? » 02 Jun 2010, 15:09

Of course these things should not happen, but when two good drivers are in the same team, with a fast car, these things happen. Fighting for the lead, adranaline pumping, Webber squeezes Vettel, but leaves enough space. Vettel gets a slight twist of overstear and they hit. End of story. For me it's a race incident. Both are to blame, of none of them are to blame. But you can not criticize Vettel for having a go.

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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by phil1993 » 03 Jun 2010, 16:12

This picture makes me wanna hit something

Image

So smug

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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by swca92 » 03 Jun 2010, 16:44

That should be posted in the caption thread.

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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by iceman1 » 03 Jun 2010, 17:05

Everythings OK Now. Nothing to conspire here :lol:

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phil1993
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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by phil1993 » 03 Jun 2010, 17:10

swca92 wrote:That should be posted in the caption thread.


Best one I've seen is: Post-race Turkey analysis - Webber and Vettel leave empty handed

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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by sdutt » 03 Jun 2010, 17:20

It says: Red Bull 'draws line' under Turkey crash

but i think they need to draw a line between the two cars (to avoid any collisions) :lol:
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Image

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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by iceman1 » 06 Jun 2010, 11:42

This is Interesting - GP.com
The only way in which it made sense for Webber to be shouldering any responsibility for the accident was if an instruction had been made for the Australian to allow Vettel to pass. The team always denied this, however, and on Tuesday, Red Bull's PR department issued its own Q&A with team principal Christian Horner.

In it, Horner states: "Neither driver was given any instruction to change position. There are no team orders within Red Bull Racing other than that the drivers should race each other with respect."

Two days later, however, the British magazine 'Autosport' published its report of the race. Its Grand Prix editor, Mark Hughes, wrote: "Going into lap 40 team boss Christian Horner instructed Webber's engineer Ciaron Pilbeam to tell Webber to allow Vettel past. Pilbeam could not bring himself to pass the message on."

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Re: Red Bull collision - Turkish Grand Prix

Post by cformula1 » 06 Jun 2010, 13:38

Hmmmm, adds another twist. If Horner did instruct Pillbeam to tell Webber to allow Vettel past, I commend Pillbeam on not passing the message on as they're equal leaders, and applying team orders in that situation is unprofessional and unsporting, regardless of who has what status within the team.
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