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 Post subject: The modern F1 driver
PostPosted: 26 Sep 2008, 10:26  
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Are they soft or simply too rich? I mean the safety is on the highest level ever, it is 99% impossible to die in an F1 car these days, even after one of the most horrendous crashes in the past 14 years(Canada 07) the driver didn´t get seriously hurt (which is of course very positive).
The runoff areas are now almost at every corner asphaltic, which means errors don´t get punished anymore. The rules for battles on the track have been sharpened, zig zag moves like Senna or M.Schumacher used to do in the nineties are now banned, lapping backmarkers had never been easier than today, during the 70s,80s and even early and mid nineties the front runners often had to really overtake the lapped cars, they didn´t just move over like today.
Life on the track is so easy for a modern F1 driver, compared to the old generation drivers, like Prost, Lauda or Rosberg senior, they had to deal with death 2 or 3 times a year, leaving the track at high and even medium speed almost certainly resulted in injuries, the cars nearly didn´t have safety devices at all, plus no power steering, 1000 hp during the turbo days, minimum runoff areas at the tracks, which consisted of gravel, so making a mistake often meant a DNF, plus the kerbs were as high as pavements, so no chicane cutting, braking too late alsmost certainly meant "bye bye".
And these drivers didn´t moan around like todays generation, they drove even when somebody had died or when it was obvious that certain tracks weren´t safe, like the old Imola.
Todays generation is moaning about everything that doesn´t suit them, the most recent combustion point is the kerbs at Singapur, the drivers crying, that they are too demanding, and if somebody runs over them the car might be damaged. Well what about if you just don´t run over them? Don´t you get paid millions of dollars per year to drive the car as accurate as anybody? It was possible in the past, so why making a drama about everything that is a bit uncomfortable for the driver these days?
They don´t have to fear for their lifes, 80% of the cornes on a modern F1 track leave mistakes unpunished, they´re earning an awful lot of money, plus the cars drive like in a video game compared to the turbo era. So why in the world is the modern F1 driver complaining about everything?

Please discuss
(Some points are a bit exaggerated on purpose, to get a discussion rolling more easily)

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 Post subject: Re: The modern F1 driver
PostPosted: 26 Sep 2008, 14:24  
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The most part of the things you say are correct. But that reflects the world nowadays. Everything in the modern world comes with safety warnings and legal disclaimers. But then again, imagine if the cars were so unsafe that we had a death every few years. Is that what you would prefer? That Hamilton really did emulate Senna or that some midfielder would die, and we could all say "Oh he deserved so much more..", like they did about Roland Ratzenberger or Riccardo Paletti (not that they didn't deserve more - they were ok pilots in awful cars).

Frankly, I'm ok with safety. No use going back to a golden era unless it fits in with the modern world. F1 is what it is, and will always be F1. I agree the cars should be lairier, and the circuits less forgiving (without actually being unsafe).

The drivers simply complain because they are all PR-driven, image-obsessed monsters. I think every single one of them, bar maybe Vettel. They all have something to gripe about, because they're the pros (as Lewis Hamilton so modestly told a Parisian courtroom), and therefore they convince themselves they have the right and the knowledge to complain like hell therefore.

The problem is that the drivers are brought up this way. It's not their fault, it's the world's fault. PR and corporate sponsorship leads to drivers becoming robots, with no real opinions bar what suits them and their team, and their push for the championship, with the rest of their opinions blending into the modern world's values of over-safety and personal risk and value.

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 Post subject: Re: The modern F1 driver
PostPosted: 26 Sep 2008, 15:45  
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Vettel's youthful exuberance will slowly fade away...
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 Post subject: Re: The modern F1 driver
PostPosted: 26 Sep 2008, 16:37  
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To be honest, most of the leading drivers in F1 have had quite bad accidents during their career in F1 and it's very much possible that without the safety devices nowadays they could be dead or unable to continue racing. After what happened to Senna, I don't think anyone would want to see something like that happen to their driver ever again.

So better safe than sorry.

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 Post subject: Re: The modern F1 driver
PostPosted: 26 Sep 2008, 19:37  
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You are right guys. But I certainly didn´t mean that we should downgrade safety, of course not. I would be as shocked as anybody to see a driver getting seriously hurt. I was scared as hell when Kubica crashed and still feel very sad everytime I see Sennas accident.
The safety standard is very good and shouldn´t be changed in a negative direction.

But what I mainly wanted to say is, why replacing all the gravel traps with tarmac? It makes the tracks less chalenging, because mistakes don´t get punished, plus creates controversy like we saw in Spa. My oppinion is, that the FIA should bring back gravel traps, they punish mistakes, which creates more tension, because the races could be decided by one mistake. today if Massa or Hamilton lead by 10 seconds and make a mistake, they simply lose 5-6 seconds and that´s it. The safety of the cars is so good these days, that it wouldn´t be a big risk to go back to gravel. But the drivers will do their utmost to prevent the FIA from making any changes that could create more action, if that means it could be to their disadvantage, like losing a win by making one mistake. But for me that´s Formula 1, the most challenging and demanding motorracing series in the world.
Those guys in the past had no problem with gravel traps and high kerbs and all that, so I´m a bit angry that the modern drivers complain about such things, it´s their job to avoid running off the road and if not they´ve done something wrong.

Of course I wasn´t talking about degrading safety, that would be stupid and dangerous.

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 Post subject: Re: The modern F1 driver
PostPosted: 26 Sep 2008, 19:48  
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Well you can thank Herman Tilke for that.

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 Post subject: Re: The modern F1 driver
PostPosted: 26 Sep 2008, 19:59  
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blizzard wrote:
You are right guys. But I certainly didn´t mean that we should downgrade safety, of course not. I would be as shocked as anybody to see a driver getting seriously hurt. I was scared as hell when Kubica crashed and still feel very sad everytime I see Sennas accident.
The safety standard is very good and shouldn´t be changed in a negative direction.

But what I mainly wanted to say is, why replacing all the gravel traps with tarmac? It makes the tracks less chalenging, because mistakes don´t get punished, plus creates controversy like we saw in Spa. My oppinion is, that the FIA should bring back gravel traps, they punish mistakes, which creates more tension, because the races could be decided by one mistake. today if Massa or Hamilton lead by 10 seconds and make a mistake, they simply lose 5-6 seconds and that´s it. The safety of the cars is so good these days, that it wouldn´t be a big risk to go back to gravel. But the drivers will do their utmost to prevent the FIA from making any changes that could create more action, if that means it could be to their disadvantage, like losing a win by making one mistake. But for me that´s Formula 1, the most challenging and demanding motorracing series in the world.
Those guys in the past had no problem with gravel traps and high kerbs and all that, so I´m a bit angry that the modern drivers complain about such things, it´s their job to avoid running off the road and if not they´ve done something wrong.

Of course I wasn´t talking about degrading safety, that would be stupid and dangerous.


I agree with you partially on that - gravel traps were dangerous at the end of high-speed corners with walls not to far away, and therefore had to be replaced with run-offs, but run-offs aren't punishing enough. Tyres only get slightly dirty for a little while. And why on earth couldn't gravel or grass be put on say, the Bus Stop chicane on the inside after the danger of brake failure/no retardation had passed, or low-speed corner run-offs like the la Source run off (on exit where all those cars run wide at exit). In which case, this fabled "advantage" would be irrelavent, because no real advantage could be gained from any cutting of corners if corners and run-offs were designed as such, to eliminate any advantage possibly gained by cutting the corner.

And I agree about the drivers' attitudes, although I think it's fitting with the current world situation that they're all corporate and PC. Maybe with world recession and possibly a large collapse, F1 drivers and the world will go all post-collapse and cyber-punk and say what they really think, and be harder-edged and more definate in their opinions and views.

EDIT:cyber-punk is hard to explain. Those who know what it is will get my reference.

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 Post subject: Re: The modern F1 driver
PostPosted: 27 Sep 2008, 08:26  
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Every sport has to go through a shape up period to suit the modern world, we can't live by the rules of the 50's 60's etc..

but the problem is that F1 has been re-shaping itself for almost ten years now, with new rules every couple of seasons!

This is certainly not good for the sport and the spectators.. Rules have to stick for atleast 5 years and let the teams and drivers deal with it
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 Post subject: Re: The modern F1 driver
PostPosted: 27 Sep 2008, 18:56  
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We need to bring back gravel traps or concrete areas so mistakes need to be punished in a true manner.
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 Post subject: Re: The modern F1 driver
PostPosted: 28 Sep 2008, 07:30  
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sdasports wrote:
We need to bring back gravel traps or concrete areas so mistakes need to be punished in a true manner.



a better idea is to hire few body builders at each turn as "Special Marshals" and anyone who cuts a corner gets a good beating from them

F1 popularity will sky rocket... never pass this to Ecclestone or he will seriously consider it lol
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 Post subject: Re: The modern F1 driver
PostPosted: 29 Sep 2008, 12:59  
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MrPonx wrote:
sdasports wrote:
We need to bring back gravel traps or concrete areas so mistakes need to be punished in a true manner.



a better idea is to hire few body builders at each turn as "Special Marshals" and anyone who cuts a corner gets a good beating from them

F1 popularity will sky rocket... never pass this to Ecclestone or he will seriously consider it lol




:) That´s certainly the BEST idea, I´ve ever heard. Brilliant mate :thumbsup:

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 Post subject: Re: The modern F1 driver
PostPosted: 29 Sep 2008, 21:07  
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Kimi would like the older racing, more fun and he would take the risks, Hamilton wouldn't he likes the soft option like Spa. I liked the gravel traps and slowly they've gone, they were punishing (Unless your Hamilton or Schumi then YOU can get the marshalls to help but nobody else can!). I want them back, and I totally agree on the attitudes of F1 drivers, Kimi, Vettel and maybe Heikki are OK though.

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