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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 02 Oct 2007, 14:08  
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Did FujiTV actually catch anything? &doh

vettel webber crash amateur:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=8hWIfBkVQUk

sato vs button http://youtube.com/watch?v=hMjsksDzi4I #Fear


Raikkonen and Kovelainen also had a scrap on the last lap and passed each other a few times, completely missed by the TV
I think this race had SO much more action than we saw on tv
Thank you FujiTV :(
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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 02 Oct 2007, 14:15  
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Suntrek wrote:
Not liking a person is not a good excuse for demeaning the things he or she achieves. The fairness and squareness of Alonso's WDCs are not arguable, however much you dislike him.

I have no problems acknowledging he's been beaten fair and square this year, btw. I don't like it, but that's another story. Doesn't mean I will question Hamilton's legality to the title. $peace


So now that we've seen what can Alonso do if he's given "equal" treatment in a F1 team what can we say about his years in Renault? if Trulli or Fisichella were given equal treatment would he have less wins and WDC's ?

Face it, Alonso can only drive if he's the official No.1 in a team... he can't STAND competition... and its okay. If you find a team that is willing to provide that for you OK, go for it.

Every WDC counts bu we as fans remember it in our own way. I will always remember that Alonso won 2005 in a car that was inferior to McLaren's but won because of fantastic reliability.

And i will remember 2006 as a year where Michael retired... at the top of his game as he showed in Interlagos... in 20 years when someone mentiones 2006 to me i will think Michael, not Alonso so i guess that will be his legacy, one WDC that people will remember... (hopefully no more in the future !grin! )
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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 02 Oct 2007, 14:29  
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Suntrek wrote:
zack wrote:
Suntrek wrote:
He won in both 2005 & 2006 fair and square. Period.

Rest part of post ..i agree..but addition..subtraction was ..... :@:2
and "fair and square" is very much arguable.
This year hamilton has beaten him...not fair and square :wink:

I do respect Alonso as great racer but not his character and attitude...which is my personal opinion. $peace


Not liking a person is not a good excuse for demeaning the things he or she achieves. The fairness and squareness of Alonso's WDCs are not arguable, however much you dislike him.

I have no problems acknowledging he's been beaten fair and square this year, btw. I don't like it, but that's another story. Doesn't mean I will question Hamilton's legality to the title. $peace

I never have question his achievements and if you involve plus and minus then you yourself are reducing his credibility .. imo .. driver is part of team ..so team is part of driver.. reliability & luck aren't excuses of winning or losing.. i never said i dislike alosno :@:2 (its limited to few things)

Btw 2007 WDC title is very questionable ... considering spy saga .. no one can refuse this :|
It really doesn't matter who wins it .. but it was going to be always questionable $peace

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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 02 Oct 2007, 16:00  
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I LOVE Fuji... especially when Alonso crashes ^cool^ This was the funniest GP in this year !cool!!!!

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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 02 Oct 2007, 20:36  
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thanks for the vids, iceman

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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 02 Oct 2007, 22:55  
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Lightning983 wrote:
Suntrek wrote:
Not liking a person is not a good excuse for demeaning the things he or she achieves. The fairness and squareness of Alonso's WDCs are not arguable, however much you dislike him.

I have no problems acknowledging he's been beaten fair and square this year, btw. I don't like it, but that's another story. Doesn't mean I will question Hamilton's legality to the title. $peace


So now that we've seen what can Alonso do if he's given "equal" treatment in a F1 team what can we say about his years in Renault? if Trulli or Fisichella were given equal treatment would he have less wins and WDC's ?

Face it, Alonso can only drive if he's the official No.1 in a team... he can't STAND competition... and its okay. If you find a team that is willing to provide that for you OK, go for it.

Every WDC counts bu we as fans remember it in our own way. I will always remember that Alonso won 2005 in a car that was inferior to McLaren's but won because of fantastic reliability.

And i will remember 2006 as a year where Michael retired... at the top of his game as he showed in Interlagos... in 20 years when someone mentiones 2006 to me i will think Michael, not Alonso so i guess that will be his legacy, one WDC that people will remember... (hopefully no more in the future !grin! )


Since you are a MS fan I don't understand that you can have any objections whatsoever to the "no 1" concept... :roll::

But you are mixing up "being faster than teammate" with "no 1 status" here. Look at Renault this year. Fisi has "no 1" status in the meaning he's the team leader. Does that mean he beats Heikki all the time? No - on the contrary. Since he can't even beat Heikki - how on earth was he ever supposed to beat Alonso? Alonso simply is the faster driver, it can't be helped, I'm afraid. It has nothing to do with any kind of preferential treatment. Alonso was also beating Trulli in 2003, when Trulli was the default "no 1" at Renault.

All teams work is about the same way in this respect (except for Ferrari 1996-2006) Both drivers have equal opportunities and equal material. From the beginning of the season there is no "no 1". Normally the driver that does better than the other -sooner or later- gets an inofficial no 1 status in the team.

For your memories of 2005 & 2006, fine. $peace

Please don't confuse your memories with "people's" memories though.

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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 02 Oct 2007, 23:14  
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zack wrote:
Suntrek wrote:
zack wrote:
Rest part of post ..i agree..but addition..subtraction was ..... :@:2
and "fair and square" is very much arguable.
This year hamilton has beaten him...not fair and square :wink:

I do respect Alonso as great racer but not his character and attitude...which is my personal opinion. $peace


Not liking a person is not a good excuse for demeaning the things he or she achieves. The fairness and squareness of Alonso's WDCs are not arguable, however much you dislike him.

I have no problems acknowledging he's been beaten fair and square this year, btw. I don't like it, but that's another story. Doesn't mean I will question Hamilton's legality to the title. $peace

I never have question his achievements and if you involve plus and minus then you yourself are reducing his credibility .. imo .. driver is part of team ..so team is part of driver.. reliability & luck aren't excuses of winning or losing.. i never said i dislike alosno :@:2 (its limited to few things)

Btw 2007 WDC title is very questionable ... considering spy saga .. no one can refuse this :|
It really doesn't matter who wins it .. but it was going to be always questionable $peace


Both reliability and luck are necessary to win races. I've never heard of unlucky drivers with unreliable cars winning them..... !grin!

I don't know if the 2007 title is questionable (Ferrari has suffered from worse reliabilty than McLaren for example - nothing to do with the spy saga) but 2007 sure is by far the weirdest season I've ever experienced. :(

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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 02 Oct 2007, 23:51  
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Lightning983 wrote:
Silver Shadow wrote:
Umm, if you read the rest of my post, you would have seen that "he has more to learn." In general, he is a team player just like the rest of the drivers are what I described them to be in general...


I read your entire post, but that one kinda stood out !grin!
I can say a lot of things about Hamilton, a lot of them nice, some of them not so nice... but a team player... well, of all the 22 drivers currently out there i would rate him in No.22 on the "nice teammate" list

fair enough. I won't say that you're right or wrong, it's what light we like to perceive things to be. I still reserve judgment on Hamilton, but I would like to see him on a team with other drivers before I can say that he is a complete team player. For now, I see him to be more of a team player, but we haven't seen anything yet...

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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 03 Oct 2007, 05:51  
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Suntrek wrote:
I don't know if the 2007 title is questionable (Ferrari has suffered from worse reliabilty than McLaren for example - nothing to do with the spy saga) but 2007 sure is by far the weirdest season I've ever experienced. :(

I'll say mclaren has won bcoz of Fia's hamilton favoritism.

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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 04 Oct 2007, 06:30  
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its good to see that more people are sharing the same views on hamilton as i do now...
its about time!

im utterly sick of lewis hamilton and frankly i dont believe he deserves this championship by any means!

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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 04 Oct 2007, 11:14  
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Okay dudes !grin!
Here's some quotes i just read from Webbo, and Vettel...on a press conference in Shanghai. Kind of interesting:

Webbo:
"It definitely contributed to Sebastian hitting me up the back because Hamilton wasn't doing what he was supposed to be doing, clearly. I think Hamilton did a s*** job behind the safety car. He spoke in the drivers' briefing about what a good job he was going to do and then he did the opposite. Still, we know for next time."

"I Had a genuine shot of winning, and it was taken away not even in a racing incident."
"It was very, very hard to swallow. It's under the bridge, it's gone and we'll never get that back."



Vettel:
"In the end it was my fault. I am not here to blame anybody but I think it is clear the rhythm was not there. We are all sitting in the same boat."
"At that point (of the crash) I was distracted, looking to the right. I was sure Hamilton was retiring, he seemed to have no power any longer, but by the time I looked back I was already in Mark's rear end."


Kind of puts a different perspective on the whole thigh doesn't it?
So Hamilton does a crappy job, and Vettel gets punished?

I actually think the real reson Vettel was punished is because he didn't destroy Alonso's car more than he did. !grin!
I doubt anyone can use the term FIARARRI after what we have seen in the last month.
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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 05 Oct 2007, 02:45  
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Lightning983 wrote:
Okay dudes !grin!
Here's some quotes i just read from Webbo, and Vettel...on a press conference in Shanghai. Kind of interesting:

Webbo:
"It definitely contributed to Sebastian hitting me up the back because Hamilton wasn't doing what he was supposed to be doing, clearly. I think Hamilton did a s*** job behind the safety car. He spoke in the drivers' briefing about what a good job he was going to do and then he did the opposite. Still, we know for next time."

"I Had a genuine shot of winning, and it was taken away not even in a racing incident."
"It was very, very hard to swallow. It's under the bridge, it's gone and we'll never get that back."



Vettel:
"In the end it was my fault. I am not here to blame anybody but I think it is clear the rhythm was not there. We are all sitting in the same boat."
"At that point (of the crash) I was distracted, looking to the right. I was sure Hamilton was retiring, he seemed to have no power any longer, but by the time I looked back I was already in Mark's rear end."


Kind of puts a different perspective on the whole thigh doesn't it?
So Hamilton does a crappy job, and Vettel gets punished?

I actually think the real reson Vettel was punished is because he didn't destroy Alonso's car more than he did. !grin!
I doubt anyone can use the term FIARARRI after what we have seen in the last month.


welll said and i agree with you 100%...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QJurnfxRm4

its about time the stewards make it seem as if they are going to punish hamilton... i think vetels punishment should be taken back and hamilton DSQ from last weeks race result... leaving him free to race unpenalised in this weekends gp.

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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 05 Oct 2007, 19:43  
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I had no doubt that Hamilton would get the penalty, as the the video showed clearly that hammy had nothing to do with it. He was on the left side of the track, while Webber & Vettel were on the left.

I am happy that the FIA removed Vettel's penalty.

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 Post subject: Re: 2007 FORMULA 1 Japanese Grand Prix-Fuji Speedway-
PostPosted: 06 Oct 2007, 07:49  
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maltafan wrote:
I had no doubt that Hamilton would get the penalty, as the the video showed clearly that hammy had nothing to do with it. He was on the left side of the track, while Webber & Vettel were on the left.

I am happy that the FIA removed Vettel's penalty.



^ at last someone with common sense. vettel was not concentrating his fault. lets say hamilton was puilling over because he had a mechanical failure (as vettel pressumed) vettel would of still hit webber. logic much
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