Gran Premio de España 2013

[F1EA]

LOL
I had Boullier's quote on my clipboard to post it here...... hehehe

But yea, it is pretty strange to allow such a fundamental change in regs. Considering a few yrs ago stuff like DRS and the double diffuser were allowed for the sake of fairness.

I guess Red bull cant handle the fact that they can't race.

And Mercedes is yet to understand they cannot go into races in the 3-4th best car thinking they locked the front row just because they are awesome. When Mercedes Q's in the 3rd row and fall back massively, i'll say they are having 'tire issues'. At the moment they are having set up and race simulation issues.

[mikhailv]

LOL
I had Boullier's quote on my clipboard to post it here...... hehehe

But yea, it is pretty strange to allow such a fundamental change in regs. Considering a few yrs ago stuff like DRS and the double diffuser were allowed for the sake of fairness.

I guess Red bull cant handle the fact that they can't race.

And Mercedes is yet to understand they cannot go into races in the 3-4th best car thinking they locked the front row just because they are awesome. When Mercedes Q's in the 3rd row and fall back massively, i'll say they are having 'tire issues'. At the moment they are having set up and race simulation issues.

mercedes cars have always chewed the rear tyres to s***. Every year. With the new compound being the softest yet, thats why Mercedes are struggling. its not the tyres, its a fundamental flaw with the car; they struggle with ALL tyres unless its extremely cool track temperature.

This is a HUGE change. To totally change the construction of the tyre to last years, but keeping some of this years characteristics can be quite risky. What if in actual fact, its WORSE for RBR. Then what? They gonna cry to go back to what they cried about?

Its ridiculous. Ferrari didnt like the exhaust blowing. Their engines cannot do it nor can they be designed to do it. Instead of banning it mid season, the accepted not to change it which is quite strange considering this is Ferrari. I think it shows strength of character in this Domenicali era. Same with 2011 hard tyres. They didnt like them, said they dont gel with them. Lobby a rule change? No. They hire a former liason from Bridgestone and fix their problem.

Thats why I find it disgusting what is happening. Everyone knew what these tyres were going to be, they had all the data from Pirelli as Craig Scarborough has categorically shown. Its upto the teams to adapt the cars to the rule change. You dont build a car and the FIA change the rules to suit it, your build a car to suit the rules. These tyres are part of the rules, tyres that TEAMS AGREED TO HAVE CHANGED FOR 2013 IN THE FIRST PLACE.

[phil1993]

Pirelli changing the tyre was not a response to Red Bull, I think that should be made clear.

[F1EA]

Pirelli changing the tyre was not a response to Red Bull, I think that should be made clear.

Yes that's true. BUT they have been the main lobbyists (and probably their puppy team) of the rule/spec change.

i think everyone is just confused. The expected result was ~3 stops. Lotus got it, and Barcelona is one of the toughest in terms of tires. They also went softer for this yr.

I know for a fact that if the same tires are kept, some (if not most) teams will in fact be doing 2-3 stops by the end of the season. AND the same 3 teams will be ahead.....

Now, Mercedes should stop putting it on pole. Renault did something like that at Barcelona a few yrs ago, but they didnt make habit of it. ;)

[kals]

I find it hard to give blame on Pirelli for the situation. For a start, they are required to produce a range of tyres to cover all different circuits on the calendar without having access to a contemporary F1 car (they are using a 2010 Renault), without inseason testing, without testing at GP circuits before the season, testing pre-season in the cold climates of europe and under some pretty stringent cost restrictions thanks to the teams.

They will get it wrong from time to time, but that doesn't mean the tyres are junk or that you cannot race on them. Each season since they rejoined has followed a similar flow...

...early season races are typically unpredictable and with lots of pit stops while teams understand the tyre. Then mid-season onwards the teams understand how to utilize the tyres and there is less moaning. 2013 is no different.

[phil1993]

I find it hard to give blame on Pirelli for the situation. For a start, they are required to produce a range of tyres to cover all different circuits on the calendar without having access to a contemporary F1 car (they are using a 2010 Renault), without inseason testing, without testing at GP circuits before the season, testing pre-season in the cold climates of europe and under some pretty stringent cost restrictions thanks to the teams.

They will get it wrong from time to time, but that doesn't mean the tyres are junk or that you cannot race on them. Each season since they rejoined has followed a similar flow...

...early season races are typically unpredictable and with lots of pit stops while teams understand the tyre. Then mid-season onwards the teams understand how to utilize the tyres and there is less moaning. 2013 is no different.

The voice of reason.

Red Bull's complaints were only heard after Sunday's race. We don't know what goes on behind closed doors.

[F1EA]

Yup.

F1 asked for these tires... it's almost out of control; but if anything, its actually MORE predictable than it was last season at this time. (7 different winners in 7 races).

Also, RB actually screwed Vettel's strategy. I remember during the race i knew their attempted 3 stop wasnt going to work cause vettel was losing too much time. Had they got that one straight, it might have been a solid podium...... so its not exactly that RB are "struggling". Its just that Lotus and Ferrari finally have a car not 1 sec slower ;)

[dacer]

Anyone knows who is first in driver and team championship?. And they are crying!!!. What do they expect?. Race with no other?

[kals]

I find it hard to give blame on Pirelli for the situation. For a start, they are required to produce a range of tyres to cover all different circuits on the calendar without having access to a contemporary F1 car (they are using a 2010 Renault), without inseason testing, without testing at GP circuits before the season, testing pre-season in the cold climates of europe and under some pretty stringent cost restrictions thanks to the teams.

They will get it wrong from time to time, but that doesn't mean the tyres are junk or that you cannot race on them. Each season since they rejoined has followed a similar flow...

...early season races are typically unpredictable and with lots of pit stops while teams understand the tyre. Then mid-season onwards the teams understand how to utilize the tyres and there is less moaning. 2013 is no different.

The voice of reason.

Red Bull's complaints were only heard after Sunday's race. We don't know what goes on behind closed doors.

Indeed. Add to the above that Pirelli have put multiple proposals forward which would help each team with tyre usage and understanding the rubber... but the teams keep rejecting these plans.

If there is a problem, and I for one don't believe there is, it is F1's and the team's fault. Not Pirelli.

[Ether]

I actually don't blame Pirelli, because they were asked to make softer tyres, and they have limited time and resources to test their tyres specs (I agree on this one).

It is F1 itself is to blame. I wasn't agree at all to change between 2012 to 2013 tyres, I mean, why they should change it? 2012 was great, do they expect any better competition than 2012? or do they want another scenario happened in 2012 when 7 winners in 7 races because teams have to learn again these new tyres?

But yeah, actually F1 itself is because the teams agree on 2013 tyres. But I guess the teams had never know that actually the tyres will underperform too far than 2012, probably much more than they expected or anticipated.

And let's make this clear again,
Pirelli decide this not because of any teams whining. Last year, some teams also whining, one of them was Mercedes. I remembered Schumi once have exclusive conversation with Pirelli, because of tyres. I remembered too some teams quoted highly degradable tyres in some tracks..
But the result? Pirelli kept it that way. No change at all. So I believe Pirelli is not get provoked by any teams.. But the media out there. By quoting some radio talks, that would be bad image for Pirelli itself and F1.

[phil1993]

Ah the Horse Whisperer, how you've been missed
http://formula1.ferrari.com/news/horse- ... -emotional

[donald29]

Have loved Ferrari's and Lotus' responses to the Pirelli change, because they are bang on. Here's Boullier.

http://adamcooperf1.com/2013/05/16/boul ... i-changes/

Ferrari or Lotus for the championship please.

[tderias]

There's no doubt that stopping four times is a bit extreme. Pirelli are right to revert back to make it 2-3 stopper. The only issue is that it seems that some teams are getting really heated up about it when they're struggling, and not so much when they weren't, like what the Horse Whisperer said.

The tyre changes are good for the fans and for the sake of racing, but not for the ambitions of certain teams. A lot of people won't be pleased if certain consequences happen due to the change in tyres, and rightly so, because teams don't care about whether races will be a pleasing spectacle of pure racing or not, they just design the car to fit the demands for the tyre, and the rules are the same for everyone.

Pretty sure we'll see a worthy champion at the end though, regardless of who it is.

[kals]

Why do people feel Schumi's 4-stopper victory at the 2004 French GP was a masterful display of strategy, yet Alonso's strategy of exactly the same at Barcelona was too much and hard to follow?

I really don't get the logic of some people's complaints.

[mikhailv]

Why do people feel Schumi's 4-stopper victory at the 2004 French GP was a masterful display of strategy, yet Alonso's strategy of exactly the same at Barcelona was too much and hard to follow?

I really don't get the logic of some people's complaints.

Because Redbull and their sheep.