The Kimi Rally Monster Cool Lounge

[Wolfie]

You know..I am busy right now(we do 500m2 foundary right now and am in a short brake) but had to say something. Valuk I checked finnish statistics about this as I was curious to know how it is in Finland. And to my surprise finnish women do stop working a little later than men.

Interesting. But maybe you will get my point of view if I give you figures for Slovenia.

Statutory retirement age: Men: 63, Women: 61

Effective ret. age: Men: 59.5, Women: 55.2

Life expectancy: Men: 72.2, Women: 80

See the problem? Women get the pension for 24.8 (80-55.2) years, men for 12.7 years. Who do you think costs the retirement fund more? But I am not blaming women, I am blaming the system. The same system that sometimes works against you/women sometimes works for you, that´s all I wanted to say.

About the farm thing. I understand your situation comletely, my parents also own a farm.

Statistics is only numbers.

What is the reality behind them Valuk? Do men have a drinking problem for example?

It's different in every country, children can shorten a woman's life too. I once saw what I thought was son and mother and found out later that they were a married couple - with 10 children.

[Leijona]

You know..I am busy right now(we do 500m2 foundary right now and am in a short brake) but had to say something. Valuk I checked finnish statistics about this as I was curious to know how it is in Finland. And to my surprise finnish women do stop working a little later than men.

Interesting. But maybe you will get my point of view if I give you figures for Slovenia.

Statutory retirement age: Men: 63, Women: 61

Effective ret. age: Men: 59.5, Women: 55.2

Life expectancy: Men: 72.2, Women: 80

See the problem? Women get the pension for 24.8 (80-55.2) years, men for 12.7 years. Who do you think costs the retirement fund more? But I am not blaming women, I am blaming the system. The same system that sometimes works against you/women sometimes works for you, that´s all I wanted to say.

About the farm thing. I understand your situation comletely, my parents also own a farm.

I do understand your point, but there's one thing I want to mention which is related to the subject. men get paid more than women from the same job (same working hours and same requirements). Iltalehti released a list today of job salaries for both women and men in Finland and it was evident that men get much bigger salaries than women from the exact same job. For example a restaurant-worker gets 2266 euros (man) compared to 2026 (woman) - in the private sector the difference is even bigger, over 800 euros. That's not fair in any way and there is no other difference than the gender, no matter the qualifications etc

[Anelise]

http://www.haastakimi.fi/

[valuk]

Statistics is only numbers.

Facts are facts Wolfie.

What is the reality behind them Valuk? Do men have a drinking problem for example?.

They do. In part it is our fault we live shorter but in part it is just genetics. Women live longer than men in most (I would say in all?) countries around the world.

It's different in every country, children can shorten a woman's life too. I once saw what I thought was son and mother and found out later that they were a married couple - with 10 children.

Well maybe, but if you look at the numbers it would seem that children shorten a man´s life much more. Or maybe it is the woman who shorten his life.

[valuk]

I do understand your point, but there's one thing I want to mention which is related to the subject. men get paid more than women from the same job (same working hours and same requirements). Iltalehti released a list today of job salaries for both women and men in Finland and it was evident that men get much bigger salaries than women from the exact same job. For example a restaurant-worker gets 2266 euros (man) compared to 2026 (woman) - in the private sector the difference is even bigger, over 800 euros. That's not fair in any way and there is no other difference than the gender, no matter the qualifications etc

Maybe men do a better job? This problem is the same in our country. But why would a manager pay a guy more than a woman (if they both do the same work, and both do it with the same quality)? I just think that a man is willing to work more long hours than a woman.

[Denorth]

nice discussion. One suggestion:
One man does all the things a woman (wife and mother of... let's say two; so family of four ) usually does for one week. I mean everything - job, care of children, cooking, cleaning, washing etc. Forgot to mention One week means 7 days, not only 5 working days

After one week it will be interresting to learn one man's opinion.

[Acropolis]

nice discussion. One suggestion:
One man does all the things a woman (wife and mother of... let's say two; so family of four ) usually does for one week. I mean everything - job, care of children, cooking, cleaning, washing etc. Forgot to mention One week means 7 days, not only 5 working days

After one week it will be interresting to learn one man's opinion.

[Denorth]

nice discussion. One suggestion:
One man does all the things a woman (wife and mother of... let's say two; so family of four ) usually does for one week. I mean everything - job, care of children, cooking, cleaning, washing etc. Forgot to mention One week means 7 days, not only 5 working days

After one week it will be interresting to learn one man's opinion.

forgot to mention: and no excuses like 'headache' in the evenings. Trust me, when you do all homework, sexdrive of you missus is through the roof

[valuk]

nice discussion. One suggestion:
One man does all the things a woman (wife and mother of... let's say two; so family of four ) usually does for one week. I mean everything - job, care of children, cooking, cleaning, washing etc. Forgot to mention One week means 7 days, not only 5 working days

After one week it will be interresting to learn one man's opinion.

forgot to mention: and no excuses like 'headache' in the evenings. Trust me, when you do all homework, sexdrive of you missus is through the roof

Why not? You said that a man would have to do EVERYTHING a woman does.

[Denorth]

nice discussion. One suggestion:
One man does all the things a woman (wife and mother of... let's say two; so family of four ) usually does for one week. I mean everything - job, care of children, cooking, cleaning, washing etc. Forgot to mention One week means 7 days, not only 5 working days

After one week it will be interresting to learn one man's opinion.

forgot to mention: and no excuses like 'headache' in the evenings. Trust me, when you do all homework, sexdrive of you missus is through the roof

Why not? You said that a man would have to do EVERYTHING a woman does.

because one man wouldn't need any exuses after couple of days doinf all the stuff

[Wolfie]

Good one, Denorth

I strongly suggest men to try that, if even for a week....

You will find out how you have to be both feminine and masculine - you are supposed to change into a masculine just like that in the evening and then again back into a feminine.

Nobody can accuse me of having very short relationships and not even considering marriage. Too many relationships that started good but ended up in me being the only one working, paying bills, cleaning, making food etc. so in one case the thing Denorth mentioned I even had to sign a binding contract not to use excuses - that was the last straw

In Finland especially, is it because so many men got killed in the war and women raised families on their own that in many cases women are stronger than men?

But anyway, Valuk, can't believe you actually said that men get better paid because they do a better job

Trust me, the lack of efficiency at work from the men's side was sometimes so frustrating that I wanted to scream - how on earth can they be so slow and unefficient???

But this is funny; the department had a deal of everyone bringing in a package of coffee once a month. There's one man and 7 women in the coffee room and the man said: I remember to bring it every month because my wife always puts it beside all the clothes she has spread out on the bed for me, starting from socks.

He did regret telling that but it was too late

[Denorth]

...

But this is funny; the department had a deal of everyone bringing in a package of coffee once a month. There's one man and 7 women in the coffee room and the man said: I remember to bring it every month because my wife always puts it beside all the clothes she has spread out on the bed for me, starting from socks.

He did regret telling that but it was too late

[ReAlien]

Did anyone post it yet?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MleuPXWo ... r_embedded

ps. Here's another one, not from rally but in similar fashion.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIcv-KoN ... r_embedded

[Wolfie]

Valuk, facts are facts but then again I could go on about facts and say many things without considering the circumstances or the factors that have had a major impact.

I don't know what it's like in Slovenia but in Finland both work, on a date both pay for their own meal and often keep separate bank accounts.

Then there's the universal thing; when reaching their 50's the story usually goes like this - the woman starts to contemplate about life in a deeper sense and the man again is terrified over growing old so he changes the wife into a 25-year old (if he can get one) and starts to live his youth again. No brainer that the woman lives longer

But men's attitude towards women is often of a kind that gives the signal that women are lower in the hierarchy. In their minds.

After working in a big company under many bosses you get to experience both sides, not all bosses act in a professional way and sometimes you have to change jobs just to get out quietly.

When I left the company I asked for references and knew they would be praising but one of the bosses said that he will only write one if I go out with him (and the bla bla bla about his wife not understanding him) - I refused, he refused to write me a reference.

I could have taken it to the CEO but then again it didn't matter, I already had enough references for my CV and also paid him back in another way. When he once again called and continued to blackmail me for the reference, there happened to be men in my room so I put the speaker on. He didn't call after that

Just to show that respect is something some have, some lack

[Leijona]

I do understand your point, but there's one thing I want to mention which is related to the subject. men get paid more than women from the same job (same working hours and same requirements). Iltalehti released a list today of job salaries for both women and men in Finland and it was evident that men get much bigger salaries than women from the exact same job. For example a restaurant-worker gets 2266 euros (man) compared to 2026 (woman) - in the private sector the difference is even bigger, over 800 euros. That's not fair in any way and there is no other difference than the gender, no matter the qualifications etc

Maybe men do a better job? This problem is the same in our country. But why would a manager pay a guy more than a woman (if they both do the same work, and both do it with the same quality)? I just think that a man is willing to work more long hours than a woman.

naah it's not about the quality of work.... there is still something very strange going on in the system and women seem to suffer

one suggestion is that maybe men are not ashamed to demand more salary?? but this can't explain everything..